Titoli di Stato area Euro GRECIA Operativo titoli di stato - Cap. 1
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StockExchange
Forumer storico
Ciao Grisù.
Sarei molto interessato all'opinione che ti stai facendo tu e anche a quella di GiveMeLeverage se passa da queste parti.
Siete entrambi, per così dire, molto "tecnici".
E anche io, al di la di alcune dissertazioni retoriche, poi tendo ad analizzare la vicenda anche e soprattutto con i numeri, perchè è chiaro che se questi fossero schiaccianti, di fronte all'inesorabilità dei numeri non c'è volontà politica che tenga.
Infatti nell'arco di un anno ho analizzato il profilo della curva dei rendimenti che mi si modificava in tempo reale, su un foglio elettronico che avevo collegato a tutti i book della piattaforma di Fineco (interfacciabile appunto con Excel).
Avevo anche riprodotto un istograma dello stock di debito per anno di scadenza, con tanto di servizio del debito con gli interessi cumulati.
Però era sui dati dell'outstanding per ogni singola emissione, reperibili nelle informative presenti sul MOT, quindi ora mi accorgo che forse era solo il debito quotato anche in Italia. Ma evidentemente ce n'è dell'altro sulle piazze internazionali, non presente in Italia, basti pensare a quello in altre valute. Infatti le cifre non mi tornano del tutto uguali, anche se grosso modo il profilo è uguale, con la gobba di massima concentrazione proprio negli anni cruciali che ora vorrebbero far procrastinare alle banche per "scollinare", anche se poi la montagna ce la troveremo comunque dopo..
Opinioni?
Sarei molto interessato all'opinione che ti stai facendo tu e anche a quella di GiveMeLeverage se passa da queste parti.
Siete entrambi, per così dire, molto "tecnici".
E anche io, al di la di alcune dissertazioni retoriche, poi tendo ad analizzare la vicenda anche e soprattutto con i numeri, perchè è chiaro che se questi fossero schiaccianti, di fronte all'inesorabilità dei numeri non c'è volontà politica che tenga.
Infatti nell'arco di un anno ho analizzato il profilo della curva dei rendimenti che mi si modificava in tempo reale, su un foglio elettronico che avevo collegato a tutti i book della piattaforma di Fineco (interfacciabile appunto con Excel).
Avevo anche riprodotto un istograma dello stock di debito per anno di scadenza, con tanto di servizio del debito con gli interessi cumulati.
Però era sui dati dell'outstanding per ogni singola emissione, reperibili nelle informative presenti sul MOT, quindi ora mi accorgo che forse era solo il debito quotato anche in Italia. Ma evidentemente ce n'è dell'altro sulle piazze internazionali, non presente in Italia, basti pensare a quello in altre valute. Infatti le cifre non mi tornano del tutto uguali, anche se grosso modo il profilo è uguale, con la gobba di massima concentrazione proprio negli anni cruciali che ora vorrebbero far procrastinare alle banche per "scollinare", anche se poi la montagna ce la troveremo comunque dopo..
Opinioni?
Ultima modifica:
Gaudente
Forumer storico
guarda che quelli che hanno perso il 40% in un anno coi GGB siete voi, mica iostranamente da qualche giorno non si fa vivo quel forumista che abita in quel di pattaya; sicuramente starà soffrendo molto: dolori di pancia, nausea, diarrea, eruzioni cutanee, vomito,........ e speriamo che non sia il batterio e.colima siano solo i ggb
Gaudente
Forumer storico
Rodi, rodieccolo, a forza di donnine
si è un pò trasformato
abbi pazienza, gaudente
oggi si scherza noi.....
IL MARATONETA
Forumer storico
perdiamo il 40% se vendiamo oggi; ma chi vende??.....guarda che quelli che hanno perso il 40% in un anno coi GGB siete voi, mica io
fino a prova contraria i miei ggb li rimborsano a 100 e ci riempiono anche il portafoglio con le cedole
tommy271
Forumer storico
Greece to ask banks to boost capital ratios: report
ATHENS | Sun Jun 5, 2011 10:12am EDT
ATHENS (Reuters) - The Bank of Greece, the country's central bank, plans to ask banks to boost their capital adequacy ratio to ease market fears over the impact of a haircut on Greek government bonds they hold, a Greek newspaper said on Sunday.
Battered by the country's debt crisis, Greek lenders have lost access to interbank funding and became dependent on the European Central Bank (ECB) for liquidity. Central bank authorities want to gradually wean them off this facility.
"The head of the Bank of Greece, after the results of stress tests at the end of June will ask banks to strengthen their Core Tier 1 ratios," Kathimerini newspaper said, citing banking sources.
The minimum ratio of Core Tier 1 equity and reserves capital to risk-weighted assets the central bank will require will depend on the haircut assumption it will make as regards bank's holdings of Greek government bonds.
"This does not mean that the Bank of Greece accepts there will be a haircut. On the contrary, as a member of the European Central Bank it is against any type of debt restructuring," Kathimerini said.
It said the central bank believes a stronger equity base may make banks' return to wholesale funding markets easier and limit their recourse to eurosystem facilities as Athens implements a fiscal plan agreed with its international lenders.
So far, National Bank and Piraeus Bank have already boosted their capital with cash calls and EFG Eurobank has sold most of its stake in Polish subsidiary Polbank to Raiffeisen..
Alpha Bank also plans a convertible bond and a rights offering of up to 2.5 billion euros and will seek shareholder approval at its June 21 annual meeting.
Banks that find it hard to beef up their capital to meet the new requirement may have to turn to the Financial Stability Fund (FSF) -- a 10 billion euro safety net set up to support the country's lenders, the paper said.
With rising bad loans, continued sovereign debt downgrades and a protracted recession taking a toll on Greek banks, authorities set up the FSF to be ready to provide capital.
Funded in stages up to 10 billion euros, the FSF is part of a 110 billion euro emergency loan package that debt-laden Greece secured from the IMF and its euro zone partners last year to avoid default.
Banks can get capital injections by issuing preferred shares to the FSF.
ECB funding to Greek banks reached 87.9 billion euros ($128 billion) in March, easing 2.8 percent from the previous month. ECB funding almost doubled to 97.6 billion euros in 2010.
ATHENS | Sun Jun 5, 2011 10:12am EDT
ATHENS (Reuters) - The Bank of Greece, the country's central bank, plans to ask banks to boost their capital adequacy ratio to ease market fears over the impact of a haircut on Greek government bonds they hold, a Greek newspaper said on Sunday.
Battered by the country's debt crisis, Greek lenders have lost access to interbank funding and became dependent on the European Central Bank (ECB) for liquidity. Central bank authorities want to gradually wean them off this facility.
"The head of the Bank of Greece, after the results of stress tests at the end of June will ask banks to strengthen their Core Tier 1 ratios," Kathimerini newspaper said, citing banking sources.
The minimum ratio of Core Tier 1 equity and reserves capital to risk-weighted assets the central bank will require will depend on the haircut assumption it will make as regards bank's holdings of Greek government bonds.
"This does not mean that the Bank of Greece accepts there will be a haircut. On the contrary, as a member of the European Central Bank it is against any type of debt restructuring," Kathimerini said.
It said the central bank believes a stronger equity base may make banks' return to wholesale funding markets easier and limit their recourse to eurosystem facilities as Athens implements a fiscal plan agreed with its international lenders.
So far, National Bank and Piraeus Bank have already boosted their capital with cash calls and EFG Eurobank has sold most of its stake in Polish subsidiary Polbank to Raiffeisen..
Alpha Bank also plans a convertible bond and a rights offering of up to 2.5 billion euros and will seek shareholder approval at its June 21 annual meeting.
Banks that find it hard to beef up their capital to meet the new requirement may have to turn to the Financial Stability Fund (FSF) -- a 10 billion euro safety net set up to support the country's lenders, the paper said.
With rising bad loans, continued sovereign debt downgrades and a protracted recession taking a toll on Greek banks, authorities set up the FSF to be ready to provide capital.
Funded in stages up to 10 billion euros, the FSF is part of a 110 billion euro emergency loan package that debt-laden Greece secured from the IMF and its euro zone partners last year to avoid default.
Banks can get capital injections by issuing preferred shares to the FSF.
ECB funding to Greek banks reached 87.9 billion euros ($128 billion) in March, easing 2.8 percent from the previous month. ECB funding almost doubled to 97.6 billion euros in 2010.
tommy271
Forumer storico
Greece to tackle austerity plan to win new bailout
By George Georgiopoulos
ATHENS | Sun Jun 5, 2011 11:35am EDT
ATHENS (Reuters) - Greece's cabinet is about to consider an economic plan imposing yet more austerity on an angry population, as the price of a second bailout partly funded by European taxpayers who have yet to be told the final cost.
The cabinet will Monday hold an informal discussion of the medium-term plan, the office of Socialist Prime Minister George Papandreou said Sunday.
Papandreou would then present the plan, which also promises a new privatization agency to speed up sales of state assets, to the political council of his PASOK party Tuesday before the cabinet clears on it Wednesday and sends it to parliament.
Interior Minister Yannis Ragousis has warned doubters within the ruling party that they risk pushing Greece over a cliff if they resist attempts to get the plan, agreed Friday with the European Union and IMF, through parliament.
Few details of the new three-year bailout or the Athens government's medium-term plan have yet been officially announced. But the unhappiness is likely to spill well beyond Greece's borders as taxpayers elsewhere in the euro zone begin to discover how much more rescuing Athens may cost.
German news magazine Der Spiegel reported Sunday the new package could end up costing more than 100 billion euros, if Athens still needs foreign aid in 2013 and 2014.
Spiegel cited estimates by experts from the German Finance Ministry and the "troika" of the EU, International Monetary Fund and European Central Bank. In Berlin, the finance ministry declined to comment on the weekly's report.
Greece agreed its first, 110 billion-euro bailout a year ago. But this assumed that Athens could resume borrowing commercially early next year, which now appears inconceivable. Athens is struggling to avoid defaulting on its existing debt and yields on its bonds are sky-high in the secondary market.
So far, Athens has received 43 billion euros under the first bailout, although it urgently needs another 12 billion which had been due in late June to cover debt repayments and for its day-to-day running costs. The troika said Friday that money should now be forthcoming in July.
GREEK EFFORTS "INSUFFICIENT"
Euro zone finance ministers and the IMF board must still back the new bailout, which would supersede last May's rescue.
Greece's commercial creditors are likely to be unhappy with the latest bailout plan, which is expected to demand that they share some of the cost of Greece's huge funding needs.
A source close to negotiations on the bailout involving EU officials in Vienna last Thursday said it would involve some participation of private investors.
Spiegel also reported that German Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble had ordered his deputy Joerg Asmussen not to agree to any second rescue package at the Vienna talks that does not include the participation of private creditors.
Public opinion in Germany is hostile to helping Greece due to Athens's failure to get to grip with its finances, and electorates in Finland and the Netherlands are also restive.
"Greece is trying, but its efforts are insufficient," said Volker Kauder, an ally of German Chancellor Angela Merkel.
Kauder, who leads her Christian Democrat party in parliament, dismissed nightly protests in Athens against austerity, corruption and mismanagement.
"We can't let ourselves be influenced by the demonstrations in Greece," she told Bild newspaper. "It's time that Greece finally becomes a state with central European standards."
The European Central Bank opposes any attempt to cut the overall value of creditors' bond holdings, known as a haircut, fearing this would badly hurt banks which hold Greek debt and provoke a violent reaction on international financial markets.
However, creditors may be asked to buy new Greek bonds when old ones mature, to avoid Athens having to produce more money.
Nevertheless, a Greek newspaper said Sunday the central bank planned to ask the country's banks, which have major Greek government bond holdings, to boost their capital adequacy.
This was aimed at easing market fears over the impact of any haircut, newspaper Kathimerini said, citing banking sources.
"This does not mean that the Bank of Greece accepts there will be a haircut. On the contrary, as a member of the European Central Bank it is against any type of debt restructuring," Kathimerini said.
By George Georgiopoulos
ATHENS | Sun Jun 5, 2011 11:35am EDT
ATHENS (Reuters) - Greece's cabinet is about to consider an economic plan imposing yet more austerity on an angry population, as the price of a second bailout partly funded by European taxpayers who have yet to be told the final cost.
The cabinet will Monday hold an informal discussion of the medium-term plan, the office of Socialist Prime Minister George Papandreou said Sunday.
Papandreou would then present the plan, which also promises a new privatization agency to speed up sales of state assets, to the political council of his PASOK party Tuesday before the cabinet clears on it Wednesday and sends it to parliament.
Interior Minister Yannis Ragousis has warned doubters within the ruling party that they risk pushing Greece over a cliff if they resist attempts to get the plan, agreed Friday with the European Union and IMF, through parliament.
Few details of the new three-year bailout or the Athens government's medium-term plan have yet been officially announced. But the unhappiness is likely to spill well beyond Greece's borders as taxpayers elsewhere in the euro zone begin to discover how much more rescuing Athens may cost.
German news magazine Der Spiegel reported Sunday the new package could end up costing more than 100 billion euros, if Athens still needs foreign aid in 2013 and 2014.
Spiegel cited estimates by experts from the German Finance Ministry and the "troika" of the EU, International Monetary Fund and European Central Bank. In Berlin, the finance ministry declined to comment on the weekly's report.
Greece agreed its first, 110 billion-euro bailout a year ago. But this assumed that Athens could resume borrowing commercially early next year, which now appears inconceivable. Athens is struggling to avoid defaulting on its existing debt and yields on its bonds are sky-high in the secondary market.
So far, Athens has received 43 billion euros under the first bailout, although it urgently needs another 12 billion which had been due in late June to cover debt repayments and for its day-to-day running costs. The troika said Friday that money should now be forthcoming in July.
GREEK EFFORTS "INSUFFICIENT"
Euro zone finance ministers and the IMF board must still back the new bailout, which would supersede last May's rescue.
Greece's commercial creditors are likely to be unhappy with the latest bailout plan, which is expected to demand that they share some of the cost of Greece's huge funding needs.
A source close to negotiations on the bailout involving EU officials in Vienna last Thursday said it would involve some participation of private investors.
Spiegel also reported that German Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble had ordered his deputy Joerg Asmussen not to agree to any second rescue package at the Vienna talks that does not include the participation of private creditors.
Public opinion in Germany is hostile to helping Greece due to Athens's failure to get to grip with its finances, and electorates in Finland and the Netherlands are also restive.
"Greece is trying, but its efforts are insufficient," said Volker Kauder, an ally of German Chancellor Angela Merkel.
Kauder, who leads her Christian Democrat party in parliament, dismissed nightly protests in Athens against austerity, corruption and mismanagement.
"We can't let ourselves be influenced by the demonstrations in Greece," she told Bild newspaper. "It's time that Greece finally becomes a state with central European standards."
The European Central Bank opposes any attempt to cut the overall value of creditors' bond holdings, known as a haircut, fearing this would badly hurt banks which hold Greek debt and provoke a violent reaction on international financial markets.
However, creditors may be asked to buy new Greek bonds when old ones mature, to avoid Athens having to produce more money.
Nevertheless, a Greek newspaper said Sunday the central bank planned to ask the country's banks, which have major Greek government bond holdings, to boost their capital adequacy.
This was aimed at easing market fears over the impact of any haircut, newspaper Kathimerini said, citing banking sources.
"This does not mean that the Bank of Greece accepts there will be a haircut. On the contrary, as a member of the European Central Bank it is against any type of debt restructuring," Kathimerini said.
tommy271
Forumer storico
Merkel ally Kauder says Greece has not done enough
BERLIN | Sun Jun 5, 2011 10:12am EDT
BERLIN (Reuters) - Greece has not done enough to repair its finances and needs a firm hand to keep it on track, a key parliamentary ally of Chancellor Angela Merkel was quoted as saying on Sunday.
Volker Kauder, parliamentary floor leader for Merkel's Christian Democrats (CDU), told Bild newspaper in an interview to appear on Monday that any decision on whether Greece would get further aid was still far away.
"Greece is trying, but its efforts are insufficient," said Kauder, a close Merkel ally and powerful figure in parliament. "We've got to use a firmer hand to lead Greece on the route to solidarity (with eurozone countries).
"We can't let ourselves be influenced by the demonstrations in Greece," added Kauder, a leading conservative voice in the CDU. "It's time that Greece finally becomes a state with central European standards. That's the only way we can prevent Europe from going to seed."
Thousands of Greeks rally every evening outside parliament in Athens chanting "thieves, thieves!."
A year after it turned to the EU and the IMF for a bailout, Greece is struggling to meet targets and convince its lenders that it should get extra funding to buy it more time to resolve its debt crisis.
Bleak macroeconomic data and increasing fears that Greece will have to extend debt maturities or impose a loss on investors highlight persistent risks to the current three-year reform plan.
Kauder said that there has not yet been any decision in Berlin about whether to approve further aid for Greece.
"Whether there will have to be another aid package for Greece has not yet been decided," he said.
"But on the other hand, I would warn against ostensibly simple solutions," he added. "If the money for Greece is switched off no one knows what impact that will have on us.
"The Americans thoughtlessly allowed Lehman Brothers to go bankrupt and that triggered a worldwide economic crisis. That should be a lesson to us," Kauder said.
BERLIN | Sun Jun 5, 2011 10:12am EDT
BERLIN (Reuters) - Greece has not done enough to repair its finances and needs a firm hand to keep it on track, a key parliamentary ally of Chancellor Angela Merkel was quoted as saying on Sunday.
Volker Kauder, parliamentary floor leader for Merkel's Christian Democrats (CDU), told Bild newspaper in an interview to appear on Monday that any decision on whether Greece would get further aid was still far away.
"Greece is trying, but its efforts are insufficient," said Kauder, a close Merkel ally and powerful figure in parliament. "We've got to use a firmer hand to lead Greece on the route to solidarity (with eurozone countries).
"We can't let ourselves be influenced by the demonstrations in Greece," added Kauder, a leading conservative voice in the CDU. "It's time that Greece finally becomes a state with central European standards. That's the only way we can prevent Europe from going to seed."
Thousands of Greeks rally every evening outside parliament in Athens chanting "thieves, thieves!."
A year after it turned to the EU and the IMF for a bailout, Greece is struggling to meet targets and convince its lenders that it should get extra funding to buy it more time to resolve its debt crisis.
Bleak macroeconomic data and increasing fears that Greece will have to extend debt maturities or impose a loss on investors highlight persistent risks to the current three-year reform plan.
Kauder said that there has not yet been any decision in Berlin about whether to approve further aid for Greece.
"Whether there will have to be another aid package for Greece has not yet been decided," he said.
"But on the other hand, I would warn against ostensibly simple solutions," he added. "If the money for Greece is switched off no one knows what impact that will have on us.
"The Americans thoughtlessly allowed Lehman Brothers to go bankrupt and that triggered a worldwide economic crisis. That should be a lesson to us," Kauder said.
Gaudente
Forumer storico
ovvio, se invece vi ostinate a tenere arriverete a perdere tra il 90% ed il 95%
tommy271
Forumer storico
German Lawmakers Aren’t Sure to Back Greece, Seehofer Tells Bild
By Christian Vits - Jun 5, 2011 2:05 PM GMT+0200
Sun Jun 05 12:05:22 GMT 2011
Horst Seehofer, head of German Chancellor Angela Merkel’s coalition partner CSU, said it’s not certain yet that the lower house of parliament will support more aid for Greece, Bild am Sonntag reported, citing an interview.
“We won’t issue a blank check,” Seehofer, who leads the sister party to Merkel’s Christian Democrats and is also prime minister of Bavaria’s state government, was quoted as saying by the newspaper. The parliament will only agree on loans under strict conditions such as a “maximum” effort by Greece to consolidate its budget, Seehofer said, according to the report.
(Bloomberg)
By Christian Vits - Jun 5, 2011 2:05 PM GMT+0200
Sun Jun 05 12:05:22 GMT 2011
Horst Seehofer, head of German Chancellor Angela Merkel’s coalition partner CSU, said it’s not certain yet that the lower house of parliament will support more aid for Greece, Bild am Sonntag reported, citing an interview.
“We won’t issue a blank check,” Seehofer, who leads the sister party to Merkel’s Christian Democrats and is also prime minister of Bavaria’s state government, was quoted as saying by the newspaper. The parliament will only agree on loans under strict conditions such as a “maximum” effort by Greece to consolidate its budget, Seehofer said, according to the report.
(Bloomberg)
- Stato
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