Gaudente
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fossi in voi sceglierei una lettera diversa dalla d
Titoli di Stato area Euro GRECIA Operativo titoli di stato - Cap. 1
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giub
New Membro
tommy271
Forumer storico
Borsa Atene: Ase chiude a -0,8%, Ote in forte calo
MILANO (MF-DJ)--L'indice Ase della Borsa di Atene termina le contrattazioni in calo dello 0,8% a 1323,27 punti.
Molti investitori sono rimasti al margine in attesa di ulteriori dettagli sul nuovo piano di austerita' del governo. "Il piano fiscale a medio termine sta pesando sul sentiment degli investitori e continuera' a farlo per poche sessioni", ha detto un analista.
Il titolo di National Bank termina la seduta in ribasso del 2,3%, Opap chiude in calo dell'1,6% e Ote perde il 3,2%
MILANO (MF-DJ)--L'indice Ase della Borsa di Atene termina le contrattazioni in calo dello 0,8% a 1323,27 punti.
Molti investitori sono rimasti al margine in attesa di ulteriori dettagli sul nuovo piano di austerita' del governo. "Il piano fiscale a medio termine sta pesando sul sentiment degli investitori e continuera' a farlo per poche sessioni", ha detto un analista.
Il titolo di National Bank termina la seduta in ribasso del 2,3%, Opap chiude in calo dell'1,6% e Ote perde il 3,2%
tommy271
Forumer storico
WestLB’s Bad Bank Has 1.1 Billion Euros of Greek Sovereign Debt
By Aaron Kirchfeld - Jun 6, 2011 5:31 PM GMT+0200
Mon Jun 06 15:31:38 GMT 2011
WestLB AG’s bad bank, Erste Abwicklungsanstalt, holds 1.1 billion euros ($1.6 billion) of Greek government debt and said it’s not in talks with European officials about a possible extension of the bonds’ maturities.
The European Union is preparing a new aid package for Greece that includes a “voluntary” role for investors after the EU and the International Monetary Fund approved the fifth installment of the country’s 110 billion-euro bailout last week.
“We’re not holding talks about Greek sovereign debt,” Marie Luise Hoffmann, a spokeswoman for Dusseldorf-based EAA, said by telephone today.
WestLB needed aid from its owners, which include the German state of North-Rhine Westphalia, as well as the country’s Soffin bank-rescue fund after running up losses during the global financial crisis. The state-owned lender shifted about one-third of its assets to the bad bank, which it established with the help of Soffin in December 2009.
(Bloomberg)
By Aaron Kirchfeld - Jun 6, 2011 5:31 PM GMT+0200
Mon Jun 06 15:31:38 GMT 2011
WestLB AG’s bad bank, Erste Abwicklungsanstalt, holds 1.1 billion euros ($1.6 billion) of Greek government debt and said it’s not in talks with European officials about a possible extension of the bonds’ maturities.
The European Union is preparing a new aid package for Greece that includes a “voluntary” role for investors after the EU and the International Monetary Fund approved the fifth installment of the country’s 110 billion-euro bailout last week.
“We’re not holding talks about Greek sovereign debt,” Marie Luise Hoffmann, a spokeswoman for Dusseldorf-based EAA, said by telephone today.
WestLB needed aid from its owners, which include the German state of North-Rhine Westphalia, as well as the country’s Soffin bank-rescue fund after running up losses during the global financial crisis. The state-owned lender shifted about one-third of its assets to the bad bank, which it established with the help of Soffin in December 2009.
(Bloomberg)
Ultima modifica:
tommy271
Forumer storico
Chinese firms sign solar power deals in Greece
(AFP)
ATHENS — Two Chinese energy firms signed deals totalling 2.8 billion euros aimed at boosting Greece's use of solar power, a Chinese trade association announced Monday.
"The cooperation in solar energy in Greece has a brilliant future, because Greece is very advantageous in solar energy and sunshining," said Zhang Yujing, head of the China Chamber of Commerce for Import and Export of Machinery and Electronic Products (CCCME).
Chinese energy group Dongfang, based in Chengdu, has signed a deal with Greek firm DTS, for a "long-term strategic cooperation" on two projects, said the Greek group's chairman Vassilis Dritsas
The first project is to produce 250 megawatts and the second is for 750 megawatts, Dritsas added, for a total 2.5 billion euros ($3.7 billion).
A separate deal was signed between SinoSolar, which has already landed seven projects in Europe, and Fyllo Energy for the production of 110 megawatts of electricity for a 35 million euros investment, said SinoSolar executive Xin Ma.
"The weather is very good, high temperatures and the sunshine is very strong, which is good for solar energy. The logistic here (in Greece) is very good," said Ma.
(AFP)
ATHENS — Two Chinese energy firms signed deals totalling 2.8 billion euros aimed at boosting Greece's use of solar power, a Chinese trade association announced Monday.
"The cooperation in solar energy in Greece has a brilliant future, because Greece is very advantageous in solar energy and sunshining," said Zhang Yujing, head of the China Chamber of Commerce for Import and Export of Machinery and Electronic Products (CCCME).
Chinese energy group Dongfang, based in Chengdu, has signed a deal with Greek firm DTS, for a "long-term strategic cooperation" on two projects, said the Greek group's chairman Vassilis Dritsas
The first project is to produce 250 megawatts and the second is for 750 megawatts, Dritsas added, for a total 2.5 billion euros ($3.7 billion).
A separate deal was signed between SinoSolar, which has already landed seven projects in Europe, and Fyllo Energy for the production of 110 megawatts of electricity for a 35 million euros investment, said SinoSolar executive Xin Ma.
"The weather is very good, high temperatures and the sunshine is very strong, which is good for solar energy. The logistic here (in Greece) is very good," said Ma.
tommy271
Forumer storico
tommy271
Forumer storico
Rating agencies might classify Greek rollover as default
By Marc Jones
FRANKFURT | Mon Jun 6, 2011 1:35pm EDT
FRANKFURT (Reuters) - European officials hope to arrange a private sector rollover of debt as a key part of a new rescue plan for Greece, but officials at credit rating agencies said on Monday they might well classify a rollover as a default.
Struggling to justify fresh aid for Greece to their taxpayers, governments of donor states in the euro zone want private sector investors to bear part of the burden of a new bailout that would effectively replace the 110 billion euro scheme agreed with Athens last year.
But the European Central Bank has warned against any restructuring of Greek debt, saying it could destabilize financial markets. So European Union officials are exploring the idea of a voluntary rollover in which private holders of Greek government bonds would agree to maintain their exposure by purchasing fresh bonds as existing ones matured.
Officials say the rollover might be similar to the Vienna Initiative, launched in eastern Europe in 2009; in that scheme, parent banks agreed to keep credit lines open to subsidiary banks in Romania, Latvia, Hungary and Serbia.
Rating agencies warned, however, that they might classify a rollover of Greek debt as a default if investors took part because they feared the consequences of not doing so. That would involve an element of coercion and mean the rollover was not truly voluntary.
A default declaration for Greece could shake markets and lead to rating downgrades for other weak euro zone states, defeating the purpose of a rollover.
"In the case of Greece sovereign bonds, it is difficult to know how a Vienna II initiative could work which was genuinely voluntary and were to generate a significant participation," David Riley, Fitch's managing director of Sovereign and International Public Finance, told Reuters.
"If they agreed to a rollover on existing terms, given that clearly the market would demand different terms for any new lending, that would be problematic in terms of being considered genuinely voluntary and not a distressed debt exchange."
MOODY'S
Moody's Investors Service holds a similar view.
"Vienna-style initiatives purport to be genuinely voluntary. Moody's would seek to assess, both before and after the event, whether that was in fact so," it said in an e-mailed statement.
"If we concluded that there was an element of compulsion, we would very likely class this as a default."
Moody's also said, "Compulsion would be defined very broadly to include circumstances where the lenders believed that absent a continuation of lending or extension of maturities, default would have occurred."
Standard & Poor's, the other major rating agency, said in a report published on Friday that a crucial issue for its decisions was whether investors were truly acting voluntarily, although it did not specifically mention the possibility of a Vienna-style rollover.
"In situations where investors consider a default to be possible and where the rating has fallen, it becomes more difficult to conclude that investors are exchanging securities voluntarily," S&P said in its report.
"For example, while an exchange offer for longer-dated bonds may appear to be "voluntary," we may conclude that investors have been pressured into accepting because they fear more-adverse consequences were they to decline the exchange offer."
EU officials have been discussing the possibility of encouraging investors to take part in a rollover by making the terms of the new bonds extremely attractive. But if Greece had to offer the sky-high rates of interest which its bonds now carry in the secondary market, that could make the rollover prohibitively expensive for Athens.
Substantially sweetening the terms in other ways, such as giving bonds super-senior status or backing them with Greek government assets earmarked for privatization, could be legally controversial and politically difficult, since it might disadvantage taxpayers in countries which contributed aid.
By Marc Jones
FRANKFURT | Mon Jun 6, 2011 1:35pm EDT
FRANKFURT (Reuters) - European officials hope to arrange a private sector rollover of debt as a key part of a new rescue plan for Greece, but officials at credit rating agencies said on Monday they might well classify a rollover as a default.
Struggling to justify fresh aid for Greece to their taxpayers, governments of donor states in the euro zone want private sector investors to bear part of the burden of a new bailout that would effectively replace the 110 billion euro scheme agreed with Athens last year.
But the European Central Bank has warned against any restructuring of Greek debt, saying it could destabilize financial markets. So European Union officials are exploring the idea of a voluntary rollover in which private holders of Greek government bonds would agree to maintain their exposure by purchasing fresh bonds as existing ones matured.
Officials say the rollover might be similar to the Vienna Initiative, launched in eastern Europe in 2009; in that scheme, parent banks agreed to keep credit lines open to subsidiary banks in Romania, Latvia, Hungary and Serbia.
Rating agencies warned, however, that they might classify a rollover of Greek debt as a default if investors took part because they feared the consequences of not doing so. That would involve an element of coercion and mean the rollover was not truly voluntary.
A default declaration for Greece could shake markets and lead to rating downgrades for other weak euro zone states, defeating the purpose of a rollover.
"In the case of Greece sovereign bonds, it is difficult to know how a Vienna II initiative could work which was genuinely voluntary and were to generate a significant participation," David Riley, Fitch's managing director of Sovereign and International Public Finance, told Reuters.
"If they agreed to a rollover on existing terms, given that clearly the market would demand different terms for any new lending, that would be problematic in terms of being considered genuinely voluntary and not a distressed debt exchange."
MOODY'S
Moody's Investors Service holds a similar view.
"Vienna-style initiatives purport to be genuinely voluntary. Moody's would seek to assess, both before and after the event, whether that was in fact so," it said in an e-mailed statement.
"If we concluded that there was an element of compulsion, we would very likely class this as a default."
Moody's also said, "Compulsion would be defined very broadly to include circumstances where the lenders believed that absent a continuation of lending or extension of maturities, default would have occurred."
Standard & Poor's, the other major rating agency, said in a report published on Friday that a crucial issue for its decisions was whether investors were truly acting voluntarily, although it did not specifically mention the possibility of a Vienna-style rollover.
"In situations where investors consider a default to be possible and where the rating has fallen, it becomes more difficult to conclude that investors are exchanging securities voluntarily," S&P said in its report.
"For example, while an exchange offer for longer-dated bonds may appear to be "voluntary," we may conclude that investors have been pressured into accepting because they fear more-adverse consequences were they to decline the exchange offer."
EU officials have been discussing the possibility of encouraging investors to take part in a rollover by making the terms of the new bonds extremely attractive. But if Greece had to offer the sky-high rates of interest which its bonds now carry in the secondary market, that could make the rollover prohibitively expensive for Athens.
Substantially sweetening the terms in other ways, such as giving bonds super-senior status or backing them with Greek government assets earmarked for privatization, could be legally controversial and politically difficult, since it might disadvantage taxpayers in countries which contributed aid.
AAAA47
Forumer storico
se anche un cambio volontario viene considerato default...a maggior ragione un qualsiasi cambio delle condizioni (cedole, allungamento, haircut) non volontario lo sara'
ma questo gia' lo sapevamo
ma e' giusto ricordarlo per chi crede che sia tanto semplice toccare i nostri bond
non e' affatto cosi'
se me li toccano, rating a D immediato!
ma questo gia' lo sapevamo
ma e' giusto ricordarlo per chi crede che sia tanto semplice toccare i nostri bond
non e' affatto cosi'
se me li toccano, rating a D immediato!
giub
New Membro
infatti è quello che dico sempre anche io. Quando si parla di ristrutturazioni, rimodulazioni, rollaggi coercitivi, concambi ecc..."farà questo o quello, ma non andrà mai in default"...... Io li chiamo gumberla, ma nel momento in cui riscrivono il mio titolo di credito (allungamenti, tagli cedole, haircut ecc ) è default. E con questo non sto sostenendo che ritengo improbabile una qualche gumberla, anzi...
StockExchange
Forumer storico
Io la questione non la vedo così semplice.
Ora le agenzie di rating cominciano a remare contro e a cavillare sul fatto che un'adesione volontaria delle banche potrebbe però avere elementi coercitivi impliciti nel timore di conseguenze ancora più avverse se rifiutano.
Tra l'altro non capisco perchè l'originale accordo di Vienna con i debiti di alcuni paesi dell'Est non implicasse il medesimo presupposto.
Va da se che in quel caso le banche più esposte si saranno sedute intorno a un tavolo consentendo di spostare più avanti le maturity, altrimenti non c'era soluzione. In quel frangente forse la situazione era solo meno sotto i riflettori, poichè tutta l'attenzione dei mercati era rivolta soprattutto alla voragine bancaria delle cartolarizzazioni dei mutui inesigibili, i CDS altrettanto inesigibili, AIG praticamente nazionalizzata e poi il caso GM.
Quella vicenda è stata gestita in modo tecnico senza essere alla ribalta un giorno si e l'altro pure.
Ora invece le agenzie di rating non mollano l'osso sulla Grecia e sull'Europa e questo atteggiamento cavilloso ora, in quest'ultimo caso, potrebbe far precipitare la situazione.
Prima la BCE ha preteso che non ci fossero riscadenziamenti se non su base volontaria, per poter ancora accettare bond greci come collaterale.
E così facendo ci è venuta in favore.
Ma se ora ci si mettono anche le agenzie di rating, cavillando sul fatto che il riscadenziamento delle banche non sarebbe poi così volontario, vista la gravità della situazione, così non si lascia una via di uscita alla Germania e agli altri paesi tripla A che sentono pesare su di loro, sui loro contribuenti, ingiustamente, questi continui finanziamenti, che si traducono di fatto in quel tanto odiato trasferimento fiscale che non era contemplato secondo i trattati.
E' vero che noi Italiani siamo i terzi contributori al fondo, e non certo gli Austriaci, i Finlandesi o gli Olandesi. Ma per noi è veramente una partita di giro, quei soldi o li tiriamo fuori così o lasciamo fallire la Grecia e li spendiamo in interessi più costosi sul nostro debito, il cui spread si innalzerebbe decisamente e magari rischieremmo pure che la situazione precipiti, perchè neanche noi possiamo permetterci tassi alti sul debito, questo è certo.
Quindi Italia, Spagna, Belgio che sono la seconda linea del problema, stanno contribuendo ben volentieri a spegnere l'incendio.
Ma i paesi dell'EU primi della classe per rating alla lunga rischiano di perderci.
Capisco l'argomento che Germania e Francia sono preoccupate soprattutto per l'esposizione delle banche all'intero sistema Grecia, oltre che ai soli TdS, e un contagio agli altri paesi deboli potrebbe rivelare conseguenze a catena oggi difficili da preventivare, non c'è stress test che tenga!
Il punto è che si deve consentire l'onore delle armi, ossia una soluzione (purtroppo per adesso si parla solo di soluzioni pro tempore, non certo definitiva) che accontenti tutti. E la Germania e altri paesi forti, esigono che i privati partecipino, o meglio, devono poter dire ai loro elettori-contribuenti, che i privati sono stati chiamati in solido ad aiutare la Grecia, visto che poi sono i primi a beneficiarne se tutto si mette a posto.
E se in particolare questi privati sono le banche, lo slogan funziona ancora meglio, perché la polemica di Main Street che deve salvare Wall Street ormai è vecchia e consolidata (e giusta per principio, aggiungo io), sin dai primi enormi bailout pubblici americani.
Dire che almeno le banche sono state chiamate a non esigere i loro crediti ora che la Grecia non ha liquidità è il minimo che si possa dire ai propri contribuenti.
Ma se le agenzie di rating ora vogliono ricattare con cavilli formali e non lasciare una via d'uscita pratica, se minacciano una bella D o una SD per quelle scadenze 2012-2014 e se questo dovesse avere ripercussioni con crisi di sfiducia anche sull'altro debito fragile della zona Euro a quel punto tanto varrebbe ristrutturare. Voglio dire, se non c'è un modo elegante di risolvere questa faccenda senza beccarsi una D, allora forse la Germania preferirà fare assegnare la D alla Grecia ma ottenere un più corposo sconto dai privati.
Che poi, detto fra noi questa gran paura del contagio vale finché le mani forti della speculazione internazionale decidono di "attaccare" in quella direzione.
Dalla vicenda di come l'Irlanda a trattato gli obbligazionisti delle LT2 poteva scaturire un terremoto sui titoli bancari e invece non c'è stato.
Al limite ne ha risentito qualche subordinata particolarmente distressed, ma anche e soprattutto in conseguenza alle pieghe che stava assumendo la legislazione Tedesca su questa materia.
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