Titoli di Stato area Euro GRECIA Operativo titoli di stato - Cap. 1 (16 lettori)

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LUP1051

Guest
Allora sono in buona compagnia ... oltre ai tuoi 21 e 41, tengo anche il 23 ...
Oltre i TF ... :).

Onorato della compagnia.

Ma il 37,,,,è proprio tanto +++ rischioso del 22; teoricamento se la situazione si stabilizza,,,,,,,la scadenza + lunga dovrebbe avvantaggiarsene,,,,anche volendo soprassedere sulla situazione tassi mondo (Giappone riduce, forse anche Usa....)
 

tommy271

Forumer storico
Onorato della compagnia.

Ma il 37,,,,è proprio tanto +++ rischioso del 22; teoricamento se la situazione si stabilizza,,,,,,,la scadenza + lunga dovrebbe avvantaggiarsene,,,,anche volendo soprassedere sulla situazione tassi mondo (Giappone riduce, forse anche Usa....)

Qualche annetto di differenza c'è ...
Come ho detto stamattina, io entrerei - valutata la situazione al momento attuale - intorno ai decennali.
Prova a fare quattro conti con i rendimenti.
Ognuno di noi conosce meglio però i propri orientamenti e attese.
 

ferdo

Utente Senior
Onorato della compagnia.

Ma il 37,,,,è proprio tanto +++ rischioso del 22; teoricamento se la situazione si stabilizza,,,,,,,la scadenza + lunga dovrebbe avvantaggiarsene,,,,anche volendo soprassedere sulla situazione tassi mondo (Giappone riduce, forse anche Usa....)

se la situazione si normalizza la curva rendimenti riprende l'andamento lineare con le brevi che rendono di meno e le lunghissime con rendimento maggiore:
visto che la curva oggi fa la pancia tra 2014 e 2025, sono queste che si avvantaggerebbero maggiormente
se invece torna tutto a p.tt.n. le lunghissime sono la scelta migliore
... vedi tu
 

LUP1051

Guest
Qualche annetto di differenza c'è ...
Come ho detto stamattina, io entrerei - valutata la situazione al momento attuale - intorno ai decennali.
Prova a fare quattro conti con i rendimenti.
Ognuno di noi conosce meglio però i propri orientamenti e attese.

A conti fatti, sicuramente.
Mi riferivo agli scatti +/- che le scadenze lunghe hanno...oltre che i volumi; buoni anche per.......trading.
 

tommy271

Forumer storico
A conti fatti, sicuramente.
Mi riferivo agli scatti +/- che le scadenze lunghe hanno...oltre che i volumi; buoni anche per.......trading.

Come dice Ferdo, se poi la situazione si normalizza (temo però che ci vorrà ancora tempo) si sovrapporrà ai ragionamenti sulle capacità elleniche di tenuta, quello delle prospettive su tassi/ripresa/deflazione ecc.

Intanto che ci sono, voglio segnalare la galoppata delle Borsa di Atene che attualmente mette a segno un + 3,28 giornaliero a 1552 punti.
 

tommy271

Forumer storico
Asian Investors First Sellers of Greek Bonds, Citigroup Says

October 06, 2010, 10:09 AM EDT

By Anchalee Worrachate

Oct. 6 (Bloomberg) -- Asian long-term investors, and not hedge funds, were among the first sellers of Greek bonds last year before the sell-off snowballed to the point the country was shut out of capital markets, according to Citigroup Inc.

“Contrary to the general belief that London macro funds started the sell-off, it was actually real money from Asia that first sold Greek bonds,” Andrew Morton, the London-based head of government-bond trading for developed economies, said in an interview. Asian investors “anticipated the crisis early and began to lower their holdings before anyone else. The queue then got longer.”

Greece was forced to turn to the European Union and International Monetary Fund in May for a bailout after investors who doubted the country would be able to finance its debt dumped its bonds, pushing borrowing costs to a record high.
Some Asian investors have become net buyers of so-called peripheral bonds in the past few months, Morton said.
“I don’t think it’s necessarily the same specific investors who sold them a year ago,” he said. “But in aggregate, we are seeing net buying of peripheral bonds from Asian buyers.”

Morton said investors should focus in the next 12 months on how citizens of high-deficit countries, including Spain, Ireland and Portugal, respond to spending cuts by their governments.
“As spending cuts are starting to take hold, the main thing to watch is how well the governments manage their populations,” said Morton. “It would be interesting to see if their people continue to sign up for these austerity programs.”

(Bloomberg)

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Chi compra e chi vendeva ...
 

tommy271

Forumer storico
Borsa Atene: Ase +3,3%, elevati volumi di scambio


MILANO (MF-DJ)--L'indice Ase di Atene termina a +3,3% a 1552,55 punti in una seduta caratterizzata da elevati volumi di scambio.
L'indice del sottosettore bancario chiude a +5,4% e a guidare i rialzi e' National Bank of Greece a +6,7%.
"Nbg rappresenta un rimbalzo giustificabile in quanto i mercati prevedono un esito positivo dall'aumento di capitale da 2,8 mld euro", afferma Anthony Christofidis, head of research di Ate Securities.
"Il mercato obbligazionario greco e' migliorato e ne stanno beneficiando soprattutto i titoli bancari", commenta Christofidis aggiungendo che "la Borsa di Atene e' conveniente in questo momento poiche' il rapporto capitalizzazione/Pil e' vicino ai minimi del 24%".
Atebank sale del 7,8%, Alpha del 6,4%, mentre Eurobank chiude a +5,2%, e Piraeus a +4,1%.


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Volumi a 131 MLN, inferiori a quelli di ieri a 173 MLN.
Scambi comunque molto sostenuti rispetto agli abituali ...
*
Spread/bund sul decennale intorno a 778 pb.
 

Jessica.

out of time...
da UCG:

Sempre in tema di PIIGS, da segnalare che l’ufficio statistico
dell’UE dovrebbe, nel corso del mese, rivedere al rialzo le cifre su
debito e deficit della Grecia per il periodo 2006-2009.
Segnali meno incoraggianti giungono invece dal Fondo Monetario
Internazionale: secondo il FMI infatti, “la ripresa economica ha
iniziato a perdere slancio dopo un primo semestre migliore del
previsto, ma i rischi di bilancio restano elevati nelle economie
avanzate". Sempre secondo il FMI, significative debolezze
strutturali restano nei conti pubblici e potrebbero contagiare il
sistema finanziario con conseguenze negative per la crescita nel
medio termine; in particolare, restano forti rischi nell'area euro a
causa dell'interazione negativa fra i rischi legati ai debiti degli stati
con quelli del sistema bancario.

Le banche europee e non, devono avere in pancia ancora del gran veleno secondo me....
Chissa' se riusciranno a tenerlo coperto..
:sad:
 

tommy271

Forumer storico
Greece - China's first European colony?

Published on : 6 October 2010 - 4:33pm | By Johan Huizinga

Is Europe the next place set for Chinese ‘colonisation’? Some say it's already happening, in Greece. But acccording to analysts, that’s overstating the case – though Europe does need to stay alert.
While the main bone of contention for China and the European Union at their Brussels summit this week will be China’s currency, the yuan and its value - an issue that may not be directly addressed is that of Greece and fears about China moving in there as a 'coloniser'.
China is making huge investments in Greek ports and railways, and even wants to buy up Greek government bonds. Greek trade unions are up in arms. Chinese investors are taking over the port of Piraeus, Athens, while the Greek docks are losing more and more customers. China wants to bring its products into Europe via its own container port, as former RNW correspondent Garrie van Pinxteren warned some time ago.
After Africa, is Europe the next place set for Chinese ‘colonisation’? According to analysts, that’s overstating the case – though Europe does need to stay alert.

Market share
But for most analysts, that’s putting it too strongly. In Africa and Latin America the Chinese are trying to secure a supply of raw materials, says Roel Spee, senior consultant at IBM Global Business Services:
“But it’s clearly a different story in Europe. People come to Europe just because they want a share of the market. They start off with small offices. But in the 1970s and 80s we also saw from small Japanese companies that they can grow to become really big. In this sense they’re certainly valuable to the European economy.”

One-man companies
Mr Spee is referring to the kind of one-man companies that merge, set up distribution centres and eventually also switch their production to the Netherlands. But because of the low production costs in China, this is only worthwhile for certain food products that need to be produced close to the customer. Nevertheless, The Hague city council, for example, is already doing its best to attract such small-scale businesses.
Another serious concern is that Europe could become too dependent on China if Beijing makes major investments in European national debts. Jules Theeuwes, economics professor at the University of Amsterdam thinks the risk is exaggerated.

Leverage
He sees the Chinese investment more as evidence of confidence in the Greek and European economies. What’s more, China needs to spread its investments and will never buy up a majority of the European or Greek national debt. Mr Theeuwes thinks it wouldn’t be logical for China to use government bonds as leverage in a trade dispute.
“According to the very blackest scenario, there would be a dispute, then the Chinese would get cross and sell all their government bonds at once. Then they’d suffer a huge loss themselves, because the value of the bonds would fall. So it would have to be a matter for which the Chinese would be prepared to lose billions, but that’s an extremely unlikely scenario.”

Doubts
Can the US and Europe still stand up to China? Mr Theeuwes thinks they can – as long as they remain the biggest consumers of Chinese products, they can threaten to introduce high import duties on Chinese products. But at the moment trade with China is much too important for economic recovery.
You have to make a distinction between private investments and those of Chinese state investment funds, warns Haico Ebbers, director of Nyenrode Business University’s Europe China Institute.
“I think you might raise doubts about the investments by these state investment funds and the Chinese government. They’re politically rather than economically inspired. But the vast majority of investments come from private companies in China and they’re economically motivated.”
So it is wise to be wary of Chinese state investment. But as long as Europe is strapped for cash, it has little choice. The Netherlands has little to worry about. At around 1.16 billion euros at the end of last year, Chinese investments, including those in Hong Kong, represented only a fraction of the 452 billion euros of foreign investment in the country. The docks of Rotterdam are currently being extended but here, unlike in Piraeus, there are virtually no Chinese backers to be seen.

(Radio Netherlands)

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Andassero gli Olandesi ad investire in Grecia, così si tolgono dubbi e problemi.
Le porte sono aperte.
 
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