Titoli di Stato area Euro GRECIA Operativo titoli di stato - Cap. 1

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Un paio di settimane fa avevano piazzato gia 5 MLD, mi pare che anche allora le richieste erano state di una ventina di MLD.
Forse era un bond triennale...

no, era anche quello 5 anni

eccolo


Meccanismo Stabilizzazione Europeo lancia bond inaugurale

Reuters - 04/01/2011 13:02:13



LONDRA, 4 gennaio (Reuters) - Lo European Financial Stability Mechanism (Efsm) ha lanciato la sua emissione inaugurale, un benchmark a cinque anni in euro, il cui prezzo dovrebbe essere definito domani.

Lo scrive Ifr, servizio specializzato di Thomson Reuters, citando i lead manager Barclays Capital, Bnp Paribas, Deutsche Bank e Hsbc.

All'Efsm è affidato il compito di reperire risorse sui mercati per gli aiuti forniti dall'Unione europea ai paesi in difficoltà come l'Irlanda.
 
FOCUS: EFSF's Bond Debut Comes Before Clear Future Role



By Mark Brown
Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

LONDON -(Dow Jones)- The European Financial Stability Facility, set up last year to help struggling euro-zone countries, is set to sell its debut bond even as European governments disagree over boosting its firepower and adjusting its role.
The money from the five-year bond issue coming Tuesday could reach EUR5 billion and will be used to fund part of the European Union and International Monetary Fund's support program for Ireland. Investors are seen asking for a higher interest rate than demanded of German government bonds, the market's benchmark.
The EFSF deal is a key test of investor support for Europe's new sovereign bailout mechanism. It comes on the heels of a EUR5 billion bond issue, also destined for Ireland, sold on Jan. 5 by the European Union for its European Financial Stabilisation Mechanism.
The difference between the two funds is in their guarantees. The E.U. has an implicit joint-and-several guarantee from the E.U. member states. If it failed to repay bondholders, they could chase individual guarantors for all their money.
The EFSF relies on each euro-zone member guaranteeing the debt in proportion to its paid-up capital of the European Central Bank, plus an extra 20% to ensure that the fund will be able to repay creditors if one euro-zone government cannot honor its guarantee.
The earlier E.U. bond attracted over EUR20 billion of orders, which bodes well for the EFSF.
"The EFSF is a done deal," said a government bond trader in London Monday.
But European authorities have begun talking about the using the EFSF to fight the euro-zone sovereign debt crisis in new ways, with broader scope and using higher volumes. EU officials are concerned is that the EFSF in its current form isn't large enough to handle bigger sovereign bailouts, with even Spain seen as a possible rescue candidate this year.
One possibility under discussion is deploying the EFSF to borrow money which struggling countries could use to buy back their bonds at depressed market prices.
Another is increasing its lending capacity, which would mean increasing the size of the guarantees provided by euro-zone members that get the fund its top triple-A credit rating.
These discussions should affect the viability of the bond.
"The way the EFSF works at the moment is that if a sovereign can't fund itself in the market, the EFSF borrows and lends it the money," said one banker not involved in this week's bond issue.
"There are discussions about how to use it better... but no agreement, but the deal will still have support from large institutional investors," this banker said.
Crucially, future changes to the role of the EFSF should not affect the status of the bonds it issues this week.
"The structure of the EFSF may change in the future but the prospectus for this issue makes clear that these bonds will be backed by explicit irrevocable sovereign guarantees and a cash reserve backing all non-AAA sovereign guarantees," said Myles Bradshaw, portfolio manager at PIMCO in London.
"So the debut issue should not be dramatically affected by the speculation around how the EFSF is deployed in the future."
"There are some investors who won't buy [the bonds], because [the EFSF] is changing shape," said a second banker not working on the transaction. "But there are enough investors out there that will buy even them if its remit changes."
And like the E.U., the EFSF should offer an attractive yield that will tempt buyers, this banker said. The EU bonds priced to yield 2.59%, or 71.2 basis points more than German bunds, and spreads have tightened steadily in the secondary market--so investors who bought them are already sitting on a profit.
But longer term, the changes being discussed to the EFSF--which aims to borrow up to EUR16.5 billion in the bond market in 2011 and up to EUR10 billion in 2012--are significant.
"What had once been perceived as shock and awe approach to solving the Eurozone debt crisis is not enough," Commerzbank analysts said in a research note Friday.
"If the EFSF were given the responsibility of buying bonds, a much larger remit would be needed," the bank said.
A likely outcome would be to increase the lending capacity of the fund. To make EUR750 billion available, Commerzbank reckoned that the guarantees the fund gets from the triple-A rated euro-zone members would need to be increased by over 70%.
That would take the German guarantee to over EUR200 billion, from EUR119 billion, for example.
And using the EFSF to buy lower-rated government bonds and help drive weaker countries' borrowing costs down "would taint the structure," Padhraic Garvey, interest rate strategist at ING, said in a note Monday.
Also, if the market deduced that expanding the EFSF implied that the European Central Bank's own bond buying program was going to be scaled down. This would leave non-core euro-zone bond markets, which have rallied following ECB intervention this month, vulnerable to a sell-off, Garvey said.
 
ah ecco
c'e' una lettera di differnza

uno e' l' EFSF, l'altro e' EFSM

ma vaff....
e' proprio il gioco delle 3 carte...
stanno facendo di tutto per salvare sti pigs, e voi ancora vi preoccupate?
se tutti sti casini non funzioneranno, allora altro che grecia...
 
e' la frase "l'hanno gia' subita" che non mi capisco
il marzo 2011 pochi mesi fa lo compravi a 90
tra qualche settimana rimborsera' regolarmente a 100
quindi dove sta la perdita?
bene ha fatto la banca a calcolarlo a 100 perche' e' 100 il prezzo che ricevera' a meta' marzo
Chi pochi mesi fa aveva il marzo 2011 subiva una perdita del 10% rispetto al nominale perche' se avesse voluto realizzarlo avrebbe ricevuto per l'appunto solo il 90% del nominale stesso.
Poi le condizioni di mercato sono cambiate ed ora il titolo scambia attorno a 100.
Tutto sta a vedere se si assume l'ipotesi che il mercato prezzi correttamente il rischio. Se personalmente avessi motivo di ritenere che il mercato sopravvaluti il rischio, allora mi asterrei dal vendere in perdita e addirittura potrei considerare l'opportunita' di incrementare la posizione.
Poiche' pero' il valore di un portafoglio e' dato dal suo valore di mercato finche' questo non migliora continuo ad essere in perdita (con la speranza di recuperarla , ma pur sempre in perdita)
 
ah ecco
c'e' una lettera di differnza

uno e' l' EFSF, l'altro e' EFSM

ma vaff....
e' proprio il gioco delle 3 carte...
stanno facendo di tutto per salvare sti pigs, e voi ancora vi preoccupate?
se tutti sti casini non funzioneranno, allora altro che grecia...

:lol::lol::lol:.
Comunque anche Dow Jones sbaglia, come da post in questa pagina.
Con le sigle siamo in buona compagnia...
 
ad inizio gennaio e' stato l'EFSM ad emettere il primo bond
domani sara' l'EFSF
quindi il post dovrebbe essere giusto
o no ?
:help:

Si, leggendo un pò meglio dice che ha venduto il 5 gennaio con il European Financial Mechanism.
Forse è la solita storia del meccanismo temporaneo e quello permanente.
Però il EFSM dovrebbe garantire solo fino al 2013 ... non dovrebbe quindi essere un bond a 5 anni.
Mah...
 
Greece should restructure debt now-Bruegel think-tank





Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:08pm EST

* Influential think tank says Greek restructuring inevitable
* Costs of restructuring get heavier if delayed
* Think-tank's research often reflected in euro zone policy



By Jan Strupczewski


BRUSSELS, Jan 24 (Reuters) - Greece's debt burden is so large that Athens will not be able to service it without a restructuring and the sooner that happens, the smaller the loss for investors would be, researchers from the influential Bruegel think-tank said.

The European Commission forecast last November that Greek public debt will rise to 150.2 percent of gross domestic product from 140.2 percent in 2010 and then to 156 percent in 2012.

"We think that Greek debt is unsustainable and should be restructured and it is better if it happens now than later," said Bruegel's Zsolt Darvas, who is preparing the research together with Bruegel members Jean Pisani-Ferry and Andre Sapir.
Bruegel research is often reflected in the decisions of euro zone policy-makers.

Darvas said that assuming that Greek debt should be reduced to 90 percent of GDP, the haircut in the value of bonds held privately and by the ECB would be 40 percent this year.

If policymakers wait until 2013, the haircut would have to grow to 60 percent, because the debt would grow, Darvas said.

The restructuring would be needed because only to stabilise Greek debt at current levels, Athens would have to have a primary budget surplus of 8.6 percent of GDP, rather than the 1.2 percent of GDP primary deficit forecast by the European Commission for 2011.

To bring debt down, the primary surplus would have to be even higher, by some 5 percentage points.
"This is too much," Darvas said.

The final version of the paper is to be published next week, ahead of the Feb. 4 meeting of EU leaders, Darvas said.
The Commission has said the summit should make decisions on increasing the size and scope of operations of the euro zone rescue fund, the European Financial Stability Facility (EFSF).

Greece has repeatedly denied it was planning any debt restructuring and the Commission has said no talks on such a scenario were going on because its consequences were too dangerous in terms of spill over effects.

But Darvas said that because market participants have made their own calculations and expected a Greek default, the consequences would not be that severe.

"It would not be a European Lehman Brothers," Darvas said, referring to the bankruptcy of the U.S. investment bank that triggered a sharp deterioration in the global financial crisis which started in the U.S. sub-prime mortgage market.
 
Ultima modifica:
Chi pochi mesi fa aveva il marzo 2011 subiva una perdita del 10% rispetto al nominale perche' se avesse voluto realizzarlo avrebbe ricevuto per l'appunto solo il 90% del nominale stesso.
Poi le condizioni di mercato sono cambiate ed ora il titolo scambia attorno a 100.
Tutto sta a vedere se si assume l'ipotesi che il mercato prezzi correttamente il rischio. Se personalmente avessi motivo di ritenere che il mercato sopravvaluti il rischio, allora mi asterrei dal vendere in perdita e addirittura potrei considerare l'opportunita' di incrementare la posizione.
Poiche' pero' il valore di un portafoglio e' dato dal suo valore di mercato finche' questo non migliora continuo ad essere in perdita (con la speranza di recuperarla , ma pur sempre in perdita)

ok, capisco quello che vuoi dire, anche se per me continua ad essere giusto che le banche,nel bilancio, ficnhe' il default non e' dichiarato, continuino a calcolare per esempio un agosto 2011 a 100
calcolare ogni giorno al prezzo di mercato porterebbe a notevoli oscillazioni
Inoltre, se una banca ha centinaia di milioni, e sul book il denaro per esempio a 90 e' solo per qualche migliaio di euro, di fatto anche quel prezzo sarebbe errato visto che il titolo e' altamente illiquido e una grossa vendita potrebbe farlo scendere a molto piu' di 90...

comunque il discorso e' vedere cosa faranno le banche perche' se nel bilancio continiano a calcolare a 100 per via di trucchi contabili, anche roba che sta a 70, accettare il buyback significa come da tuo post, accettare la perdita reale
insomma...
le banche alla fine potrebbero anche dire che non accettano e vogliono 100
Vi sembra poco probabile?
e i cds a che servono?
magari le banche che sono gia' coperte con i cds potrebbero benissimo rifiutarsi di "svenderle"
 
C'è differenza tra ptf trading e ptf da portare a scadenza
Lo avevano evidenziato anche gli stress test dell'estate scorsa
 
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