Cat XL
Shizuka Minamoto
Ti consiglio di andare a vedere i capital ratio di Binck sul loro sito. Sono molto alti...difficile che fallisca. Ma tutto puo' capitare.
Obbligazioni perpetue e subordinate SNS Reeal in diretta: storia di un esproprio - Notizie, informazioni e commenti
Ti consiglio di andare a vedere i capital ratio di Binck sul loro sito. Sono molto alti...difficile che fallisca. Ma tutto puo' capitare.
bluto
Forumer attivo
sai che me ne posso fare dei capital ratio del sito?
lo stesso che me ne faccio del controllo della banca d'olanda...
Cat XL
Shizuka Minamoto
Te l'ho detto per tranquillizzarti un po. Ti vedo un po agitato. In una settimana hai scritto i messaggi che una persona scrive mediamente in un anno...
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Ultima modifica:
bluto
Forumer attivo
Te l'ho detto per tranquillizzarti un po. Ti vedo un po agitato. In una settimana hai scritto i messaggi che una persona scrive mediamente in un anno...
ok, cercherò di scrivere meno...
Cat XL
Shizuka Minamoto
ok, cercherò di scrivere meno...
La causa e' partita. Siamo in ottime mani. A questo punto vediamo cosa succede.
Purtroppo e' una situazione amara per tutti. Chi piu' chi meno. L'importante e' capire come non trovarsi di nuovo in una situazione del genere. Purtroppo SNS e' stato il primo caso del genere e noi siamo le cavie di questo scellerato caso.
ferdo
Utente Senior
Beh, questo potrebbe essere il tam tam da disseminare
Facciamoci una pensata, magari si può aprire un 3D su FOL, sezione "conti deposito sicuri", sottoponendo le stesse "logiche e condivisibili argomentazioni" sull'esproprio delle obbligazioni SNS.
Facendo attenzione a non buscarsi una querela
Un terrorista anni 70 avrebbe iniziato con una molotov ai banchetti ing nei centri commerciali ma forse avrebbe simpatizzato per l esproprio popolare
bmwz4black
Nuovo forumer
SNS May Sell Shares, Involve Bond Holders in Rescue Plan - Bloomberg
del 28 gennaio ( quindi pochissimi giorni prima del "furto" ):
SNS Reaal NV (SR) a Dutch bank and insurer struggling with real estate losses, plans to strengthen capital buffers by selling a stake to private investors and involve bond holders to help limit the burden on taxpayers. “The efforts of SNS Reaal are focused on a scenario that involves the participation of private investors,” the Utrecht- based company said in an e-mailed statement today. The plan would include “a significant share issue” while “transactions with regard to outstanding subordinated instruments are anticipated,” SNS said. No decisions have been made, it said.
SNS Reaal, which acquired ABN Amro’s property-finance unit in 2006, has been hurt by losses on real estate loans that left it struggling to repay a government bailout. The bank’s core Tier 1 capital ratio, a measure of financial strength, fell to 8.8 percent at the end of the third quarter, below the European Banking Authority’s 9 percent minimum, as risk-weighted assets and loan losses in the property-finance unit increased.
SNS swung from a gain of as much as 9 percent to a drop of as much as 5.1 percent in Amsterdam trading today. The stock was up 2 cents, or 2.4 percent, to 80 cents as of 10:37 a.m., for a market value of 228 million euros ($307 million).
‘Comprehensive Solution’
“The situation remains clearly uncertain with respect to feasibility,” said Albert Ploegh, an Amsterdam-based analyst at ING Groep NV. (INGA) “The main issue whether a private solution can be found in our view is related to the size of estimated losses at Property Finance, demanded guarantees by potential investors” and their credibility, he said. “It seems that time is short.”
SNS, which went public in 2006, is seeking a “comprehensive solution” for cutting credit risks at the property-finance unit and to strengthen its capital. The property unit may be split-off, it said in today’s statement.
It is unclear whether the path SNS is pursuing is feasible as the parties involved are assessing future losses on real estate loans, the company said.
SNS started withdrawing from commercial real estate lending in 2009, when the unit reported a loss of 219 million euros. With loan losses spreading from the U.S. to its home market, it has remained unprofitable every year since. From August 2009 until the end of September, SNS Reaal has cut back its commitments by 48 percent to 8.3 billion euros, according to a presentation on Nov. 15. The run-off hit a glitch as property values decreased and as refinancing of loans became more difficult, it said.
Dutch Bailout
SNS may have to write down as much as 1.8 billion euros on the property-finance portfolio, newspaper Het Financieele Dagblad reported on Jan. 16. SNS hasn’t confirmed the number.
SNS received 750 million euros from the Netherlands in 2008 and 500 million euros from Foundation Beheer SNS Reaal, its largest shareholder. SNS sold shares in 2009 to help repay 250 million euros of aid, of which 185 million euros was returned to the government. The aid, granted in the form of core Tier 1 securities issued to the state, may be converted into ordinary shares, it said in November.
SNS Reaal is the smallest of four Dutch banks designated as “systemically important,” or too big to fail, by the Dutch central bank. It had 32.5 billion euros in savings at the end of the third quarter, according to the Nov. 15 presentation. ING, Rabobank Groep and ABN Amro Group NV are its three largest competitors.
Following the financial crisis that led the government to nationalize the Dutch parts of Fortis and ABN Amro Holding NV and the bankruptcy of DSB Bank NV, the Netherlands adopted legislation allowing its central bank to transfer banks’ assets, liabilities or stock.
To contact the reporter on this story: Maud van Gaal in Amsterdam at [email protected]
To contact the editor responsible for this story: Frank Connelly at [email protected]
del 28 gennaio ( quindi pochissimi giorni prima del "furto" ):
SNS Reaal NV (SR) a Dutch bank and insurer struggling with real estate losses, plans to strengthen capital buffers by selling a stake to private investors and involve bond holders to help limit the burden on taxpayers. “The efforts of SNS Reaal are focused on a scenario that involves the participation of private investors,” the Utrecht- based company said in an e-mailed statement today. The plan would include “a significant share issue” while “transactions with regard to outstanding subordinated instruments are anticipated,” SNS said. No decisions have been made, it said.
SNS Reaal, which acquired ABN Amro’s property-finance unit in 2006, has been hurt by losses on real estate loans that left it struggling to repay a government bailout. The bank’s core Tier 1 capital ratio, a measure of financial strength, fell to 8.8 percent at the end of the third quarter, below the European Banking Authority’s 9 percent minimum, as risk-weighted assets and loan losses in the property-finance unit increased.
SNS swung from a gain of as much as 9 percent to a drop of as much as 5.1 percent in Amsterdam trading today. The stock was up 2 cents, or 2.4 percent, to 80 cents as of 10:37 a.m., for a market value of 228 million euros ($307 million).
‘Comprehensive Solution’
“The situation remains clearly uncertain with respect to feasibility,” said Albert Ploegh, an Amsterdam-based analyst at ING Groep NV. (INGA) “The main issue whether a private solution can be found in our view is related to the size of estimated losses at Property Finance, demanded guarantees by potential investors” and their credibility, he said. “It seems that time is short.”
SNS, which went public in 2006, is seeking a “comprehensive solution” for cutting credit risks at the property-finance unit and to strengthen its capital. The property unit may be split-off, it said in today’s statement.
It is unclear whether the path SNS is pursuing is feasible as the parties involved are assessing future losses on real estate loans, the company said.
SNS started withdrawing from commercial real estate lending in 2009, when the unit reported a loss of 219 million euros. With loan losses spreading from the U.S. to its home market, it has remained unprofitable every year since. From August 2009 until the end of September, SNS Reaal has cut back its commitments by 48 percent to 8.3 billion euros, according to a presentation on Nov. 15. The run-off hit a glitch as property values decreased and as refinancing of loans became more difficult, it said.
Dutch Bailout
SNS may have to write down as much as 1.8 billion euros on the property-finance portfolio, newspaper Het Financieele Dagblad reported on Jan. 16. SNS hasn’t confirmed the number.
SNS received 750 million euros from the Netherlands in 2008 and 500 million euros from Foundation Beheer SNS Reaal, its largest shareholder. SNS sold shares in 2009 to help repay 250 million euros of aid, of which 185 million euros was returned to the government. The aid, granted in the form of core Tier 1 securities issued to the state, may be converted into ordinary shares, it said in November.
SNS Reaal is the smallest of four Dutch banks designated as “systemically important,” or too big to fail, by the Dutch central bank. It had 32.5 billion euros in savings at the end of the third quarter, according to the Nov. 15 presentation. ING, Rabobank Groep and ABN Amro Group NV are its three largest competitors.
Following the financial crisis that led the government to nationalize the Dutch parts of Fortis and ABN Amro Holding NV and the bankruptcy of DSB Bank NV, the Netherlands adopted legislation allowing its central bank to transfer banks’ assets, liabilities or stock.
To contact the reporter on this story: Maud van Gaal in Amsterdam at [email protected]
To contact the editor responsible for this story: Frank Connelly at [email protected]
duecent
Nuovo forumer
Sin qui vi seguo in questo interessante ragionamento, ma vi domando:
e allora di chi ci dovremmo fidare ?
Chi mi assicura che ISP o UNI possano essere diverse? migliori?
La Banca d'Italia?
La stessa, cioè, che non si è MAI accorta di nulla sulle faccende MPS ?
La verità - imho - è che alla fine ci si deve fidare di quel che le società dichiarano nei bilanci. Almeno per noi piccoli è così. Se una banca ha un buco colossale e non lo dichiara, per me ( per noi), è una buona banca.
Se domani fallisce io (noi) rimango con il cerino in mano.
Sbaglio ?
La vicenda SNS non è diversa da questo esempio. Ci stanno dicendo ORA che è stata nazionalizzata proprio perché il buco era - senza che nessuno mai lo dicesse con i giusti numeri - molto più grande del dichiarato.
Con scenari come questi, dire ISP o UNI non aumenta la sicurezza.....
Nell'azzeramento delle Lt2 irlandesi chi ha fatto causa alle banche e al primo ministro ha vinto ( sta per uscire la sentenza d'appello ), anche se si sono mossi tardivamente. Chi è stato tempestivo, come noi adesso, è stato pagato per ritirare l'azione legale. Il precedente promette bene, e loro non avevano fatto ricorso alla Commissione UE.
Siamo in mani straordinarie, sono seguita da loro anche per l'Irlanda. Ci sarà da lottare, ma sono tranquilla ...
Grazie Ella.....questa notizia e' di ottimo supporto al mio morale ...ho cmq fiducia nella macchina organizzativa guidata da Zorba che in un tempo così veloce ha scaldato i motori e gia' corre a mille....certo ci vorrà anche una buona dose di c.....perche' tutto vada per il meglio. Mi spiace molto x quella coppia che ci stà rimettendo i risparmi di una vita...ci hanno proprio bidonato questi civilissimi nordeuropei.
Io non ero esposto moltissimo ma a caldo sono scappato da tutte le perpetual e ancora non ho quantificato il danno....azz.
ferdo
Utente Senior
Anche ame han risposto così allora gli ho chiesto copia della lettera informativa del 24 genn sopra citata
Aspetto risposta se mi scrivono che è riservata gli chiedo quale è l ultimo documento pubblico disponibile di Dnb su sns