ferdo
Utente Senior
Come non detto, scrive che il contributo dei sub diminuisce il contributo statale di 1 bln
Obbligazioni perpetue e subordinate SNS Reeal in diretta: storia di un esproprio - Notizie, informazioni e commenti
Come non detto, scrive che il contributo dei sub diminuisce il contributo statale di 1 bln
Topgun1976
Guest
Some investors believe that under the EU Human Rights Directive, governments must pay fair value in compensation for assets expropriated; however, as the UK government proved with Northern Rock, "fair value" can be zero for equity in an insolvent bank. We note that in the case of Northern Rock, Lower Tier 2 continued to pay coupons following its nationalisation, and was eventually subject to attractive liability management. Given that the Dutch government intends to inject €3.7bn into SNS, the expropriated sub debt will not fare as well, in our view.
Topgun1976
Guest
pare che i sub siano intorno a 1,7miliardi ai quali devi aggiungerci le Azioni A e le B.
tutti dati presi dai report
Tobia
Forumer storico
già comunque l'amico olandese dice pur sempre questo:
"I will make an official offer of compensation to the expropriated parties as soon as possible."
non mi va di essere preso per il kulo la seconda volta quindi per me resta 0
SNS Reaal (SR) NV’s nationalization triggered a surge in the cost of insuring against default on European junior bank debt amid concern the move will encourage governments to impose losses on bondholders.
The Markit iTraxx Financial Index of credit-default swaps on the subordinated bonds of 25 banks and insurers jumped as much as 15 basis points, the most since Sept. 26, to a more than seven-week high of 265, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The move was led by contracts on UniCredit SpA (UCG), which rose 14 basis points to 518.
The Netherlands moved to take control of SNS Reaal after real estate losses brought the nation’s fourth-largest lender to the brink of collapse. Dutch Finance Minister Jeroen Dijsselbloem said today that, while the government will “expropriate” SNS’s equity and subordinated debt, senior bondholders won’t be affected.
“There’s a trend of using sub bondholders to recover capital for bad banks around Europe,” said Alberto Gallo, head of European macro credit research at Royal Bank of Scotland Group Plc (RBS) in London. “After Ireland, there’s been Spain and now there’s Cyprus and Holland and there could be other cases going forward.”
Irish lenders imposed losses of as much as 90 percent on their junior debt investors as the government pledged 64 billion euros ($87.4 billion) to rescue them following that country’s housing collapse. Cypriot Finance Minister Vassos Shiarly said yesterday junior creditors will have to take losses in a proposed rescue of the country’s banks.
Monte Paschi
Credit-default swaps on the junior debt of Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena SpA (BMPS) rose for a fifth day to the highest since November. The Italian lender is seeking state help to bolster its balance sheet after failing to meet capital requirements set by the European Banking Authority and faces a criminal probe into money-losing structured deals.
Contracts on the junior debt of ING Bank NV, the biggest Dutch financial-services company, rose 12 basis points to 210 and Intesa Sanpaolo SpA (ISP) increased six basis points to 418.
“These are not only problems for the Dutch banks and insurers but also for others in Europe,” said Bill Blain, a strategist at Mint Partners in London. “The bail-in of SNS should leave capital holders of other struggling European banks wondering.”
Credit-default swaps on SNS’s senior debt were quoted at 399 basis points, according to data provider CMA. The lender is not included in the credit-default swaps index or among the 1,000 most-traded companies tracked by the Depository Trust & Clearing Corp.
Junior Bonds
SNS’s junior bonds tumbled to record lows, with its 250 million euros of 6.258 percent Tier 1 perpetual notes quoted 25 euro cents, or 61 percent, lower at 15.5 cents, according to Bloomberg prices. Its senior bonds rose after the government said investors in these notes won’t face losses.
The Utrecht, Netherlands-based bank and insurer received a government bailout in 2008, two years after acquiring ABN Amro Holding NV’s property finance unit. .
SNS’s 301 million euros of 6.625 percent senior, unsecured bonds maturing in November 2016 rose 1.7 euro cents to 105.36, Bloomberg prices show. The Dutch lender’s 615 million euros of 0.285 percent senior floating-rate notes due June 2014 climbed 1 euro cent to 94.78 cents.
The subordinated financial index pared its advance after a report showed hiring increased in the U.S. in January after accelerating more than previously estimated at the end of 2012, and was trading at 255 basis points at 2:30 p.m. in London.
The Markit iTraxx Financial Index linked to senior debt of 25 banks and insurers increased three basis points to 150. The Markit iTraxx Europe Index of 125 companies with investment- grade ratings, including the 25 financial companies, rose 1.5 basis points to 114.
The Markit iTraxx Crossover Index of credit-default swaps on 50 companies with mostly high-yield credit ratings climbed three basis points to 445. An increase signals deterioration in perceptions of credit quality.
A basis point on a credit-default swap protecting 10 million euros of debt from default for five years is equivalent to 1,000 euros a year. Swaps pay the buyer face value in exchange for the underlying securities or the cash equivalent should a borrower fail to adhere to its debt agreements.
To contact the reporter on this story: Abigail Moses in London at [email protected]
To contact the editor responsible for this story: Paul Armstrong at [email protected]
The Markit iTraxx Financial Index of credit-default swaps on the subordinated bonds of 25 banks and insurers jumped as much as 15 basis points, the most since Sept. 26, to a more than seven-week high of 265, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The move was led by contracts on UniCredit SpA (UCG), which rose 14 basis points to 518.
The Netherlands moved to take control of SNS Reaal after real estate losses brought the nation’s fourth-largest lender to the brink of collapse. Dutch Finance Minister Jeroen Dijsselbloem said today that, while the government will “expropriate” SNS’s equity and subordinated debt, senior bondholders won’t be affected.
“There’s a trend of using sub bondholders to recover capital for bad banks around Europe,” said Alberto Gallo, head of European macro credit research at Royal Bank of Scotland Group Plc (RBS) in London. “After Ireland, there’s been Spain and now there’s Cyprus and Holland and there could be other cases going forward.”
Irish lenders imposed losses of as much as 90 percent on their junior debt investors as the government pledged 64 billion euros ($87.4 billion) to rescue them following that country’s housing collapse. Cypriot Finance Minister Vassos Shiarly said yesterday junior creditors will have to take losses in a proposed rescue of the country’s banks.
Monte Paschi
Credit-default swaps on the junior debt of Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena SpA (BMPS) rose for a fifth day to the highest since November. The Italian lender is seeking state help to bolster its balance sheet after failing to meet capital requirements set by the European Banking Authority and faces a criminal probe into money-losing structured deals.
Contracts on the junior debt of ING Bank NV, the biggest Dutch financial-services company, rose 12 basis points to 210 and Intesa Sanpaolo SpA (ISP) increased six basis points to 418.
“These are not only problems for the Dutch banks and insurers but also for others in Europe,” said Bill Blain, a strategist at Mint Partners in London. “The bail-in of SNS should leave capital holders of other struggling European banks wondering.”
Credit-default swaps on SNS’s senior debt were quoted at 399 basis points, according to data provider CMA. The lender is not included in the credit-default swaps index or among the 1,000 most-traded companies tracked by the Depository Trust & Clearing Corp.
Junior Bonds
SNS’s junior bonds tumbled to record lows, with its 250 million euros of 6.258 percent Tier 1 perpetual notes quoted 25 euro cents, or 61 percent, lower at 15.5 cents, according to Bloomberg prices. Its senior bonds rose after the government said investors in these notes won’t face losses.
The Utrecht, Netherlands-based bank and insurer received a government bailout in 2008, two years after acquiring ABN Amro Holding NV’s property finance unit. .
SNS’s 301 million euros of 6.625 percent senior, unsecured bonds maturing in November 2016 rose 1.7 euro cents to 105.36, Bloomberg prices show. The Dutch lender’s 615 million euros of 0.285 percent senior floating-rate notes due June 2014 climbed 1 euro cent to 94.78 cents.
The subordinated financial index pared its advance after a report showed hiring increased in the U.S. in January after accelerating more than previously estimated at the end of 2012, and was trading at 255 basis points at 2:30 p.m. in London.
The Markit iTraxx Financial Index linked to senior debt of 25 banks and insurers increased three basis points to 150. The Markit iTraxx Europe Index of 125 companies with investment- grade ratings, including the 25 financial companies, rose 1.5 basis points to 114.
The Markit iTraxx Crossover Index of credit-default swaps on 50 companies with mostly high-yield credit ratings climbed three basis points to 445. An increase signals deterioration in perceptions of credit quality.
A basis point on a credit-default swap protecting 10 million euros of debt from default for five years is equivalent to 1,000 euros a year. Swaps pay the buyer face value in exchange for the underlying securities or the cash equivalent should a borrower fail to adhere to its debt agreements.
To contact the reporter on this story: Abigail Moses in London at [email protected]
To contact the editor responsible for this story: Paul Armstrong at [email protected]
Cat XL
Shizuka Minamoto
Ultima modifica:
Pandemonium
Nuovo forumer
Per favore scrivete a tutte le associazioni di consumatori che conoscete
Ecco la riposta pervenutami da ADUC ADUC - Investire
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]Gentile xxx,
E' naturalmente impossibile per un singolo investitore presentare ricorso al Consiglio di Stato olandese, e perfino entro dieci giorni dal 1 febbraio, come anche per noi è impossibile anche solo ipotizzare di poterlo assistere in questi termini. Simili azioni sono condotte da investitori istituzionali che hanno i mezzi economici ed organizzativi per poterle condurre, e di sicuro ci saranno fondi comuni, e soprattutto studi legali internazionali, che lavoreranno alacremente in questi dieci giorni per presentare opposizione. Da questo punto di vista, quindi, si può stare tranquilli.
Di sicuro, quello che è successo oggi 1 febbraio ha dell'eccezionale: il governo olandese ha deciso di nazionalizzare Sns Bank ma anche di espropriare senza alcun corrispettivo le azioni (e passi, perché tanto il capitale sarebbe stato ugualmente azzerato) ma anche tutto il debito non "senior", quindi pure le obbligazioni subordinate.
Si apre, quindi, una nuova vicenda "molto poco simpatica" che stiamo seguendo sin da questa mattina non appena è apparso il comunicato del governo e dove non mancheremo di informare ed assistere tutti gli interessati.
Cordiali saluti.
ADUC[/FONT]
Ecco la riposta pervenutami da ADUC ADUC - Investire
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]Gentile xxx,
E' naturalmente impossibile per un singolo investitore presentare ricorso al Consiglio di Stato olandese, e perfino entro dieci giorni dal 1 febbraio, come anche per noi è impossibile anche solo ipotizzare di poterlo assistere in questi termini. Simili azioni sono condotte da investitori istituzionali che hanno i mezzi economici ed organizzativi per poterle condurre, e di sicuro ci saranno fondi comuni, e soprattutto studi legali internazionali, che lavoreranno alacremente in questi dieci giorni per presentare opposizione. Da questo punto di vista, quindi, si può stare tranquilli.
Di sicuro, quello che è successo oggi 1 febbraio ha dell'eccezionale: il governo olandese ha deciso di nazionalizzare Sns Bank ma anche di espropriare senza alcun corrispettivo le azioni (e passi, perché tanto il capitale sarebbe stato ugualmente azzerato) ma anche tutto il debito non "senior", quindi pure le obbligazioni subordinate.
Si apre, quindi, una nuova vicenda "molto poco simpatica" che stiamo seguendo sin da questa mattina non appena è apparso il comunicato del governo e dove non mancheremo di informare ed assistere tutti gli interessati.
Cordiali saluti.
ADUC[/FONT]
bluto
Forumer attivo
assurdo: per JD valgono zero
però un offerta la farò asap chiedendo alla corte di confermarla
un pazzo
SNS Reaal Junior Bonds at Record Low After Dutch Nationalization
SNS Reaal Junior Bonds Tumble to Record on Dutch Nationalization
SNS Reaal NV (SR)’s junior bonds were quoted at record lows after the Dutch government seized the securities as part of the lender’s nationalization.
SNS’s 250 million euros ($341 million) of 6.258 percent Tier 1 perpetual notes were 25 euro cents, or 61 percent, lower at 15.5 cents as of 11:10 a.m. in London, according to Bloomberg prices. Its senior bonds were quoted higher after the government said investors in these notes won’t face losses.
The Utrecht, Netherlands-based bank and insurer was nationalized after real estate losses eroded its capital. Dutch Finance Minister Jeroen Dijsselbloem said at a press conference today that, while the government will “expropriate” SNS’s equity and subordinated debt, senior bondholders won’t be affected.
“It’s not clear what value will be given to sub debt, if any,” said Eva Olsson, an analyst at Mitsubishi UFJ Securities in London. “The situation is aggravated by the fact no private investor is likely to participate in the recapitalization.”
SNS’s 301 million euros of 6.625 percent senior, unsecured bonds maturing in November 2016 were quoted 4 euro cents higher at 107.7, Bloomberg prices show. That’s after they fell to 102.71 Jan. 29.
The Dutch lender’s 615 million euros of 0.285 percent senior floating-rate notes due June 2014 were quoted up 1.8 euro cents at 95.62 cents, according to Bloomberg prices.
Bonds Seized
The decree published by the Dutch Ministry of Finance didn’t set out what would happen to junior bond trades executed in the three days running up to the expropriation. Bond trades typically settle three days after they’re agreed.
“I suspect the buyer of a bond yesterday won’t pay because he’s not delivered the securities,” said Bill Blain, a London- based strategist at brokerage Mint Partners Ltd.
Subordinated bonds issued by other banks fell. ING Groep NV’s 1.5 billion euros of 8 percent, junior subordinated perpetual notes redeemable by the lender this April dropped 1.5 cents to a four-month low of 100.04, Bloomberg prices show.
The 591.5 million euros of 4.875 percent junior subordinated notes due May 2016 of Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena SpA, the Italian lender whose credit rating was cut by Standard & Poor’s late yesterday, dropped 1 euro cent to 86.75. The securities were at 99.38 cents as recently as Jan. 22, Bloomberg prices show.
Risk Higher
The so-called impairment of SNS’s junior bondholders helped push the cost of insuring European lower-ranked bank debt to the highest since Dec. 11.
The Markit iTraxx Financial Index of credit-default swaps tied to the subordinated debt of 25 banks and insurers rose 12 basis points to 262, the biggest jump since October, according to prices compiled by Bloomberg. The senior gauge climbed three basis points to a 1 1/2-month high of 150.
Credit-default swaps pay the buyer face value in exchange for the underlying securities or the cash equivalent should a borrower fail to adhere to its debt agreements. A basis point on a contract protecting 10 million euros of debt for five years is equivalent to 1,000 euros a year.
SNS received a government bailout in 2008, two years after acquiring ABN Amro Holding NV’s property finance unit. The lender’s core Tier 1 capital ratio, a measure of financial strength, fell to 8.8 percent at the end of the third quarter, below the European Banking Authority’s 9 percent minimum, as real estate losses mounted.
To contact the reporter on this story: John Glover in London at [email protected]
To contact the editor responsible for this story: Paul Armstrong at [email protected]
SNS Reaal Junior Bonds Tumble to Record on Dutch Nationalization
SNS Reaal NV (SR)’s junior bonds were quoted at record lows after the Dutch government seized the securities as part of the lender’s nationalization.
SNS’s 250 million euros ($341 million) of 6.258 percent Tier 1 perpetual notes were 25 euro cents, or 61 percent, lower at 15.5 cents as of 11:10 a.m. in London, according to Bloomberg prices. Its senior bonds were quoted higher after the government said investors in these notes won’t face losses.
The Utrecht, Netherlands-based bank and insurer was nationalized after real estate losses eroded its capital. Dutch Finance Minister Jeroen Dijsselbloem said at a press conference today that, while the government will “expropriate” SNS’s equity and subordinated debt, senior bondholders won’t be affected.
“It’s not clear what value will be given to sub debt, if any,” said Eva Olsson, an analyst at Mitsubishi UFJ Securities in London. “The situation is aggravated by the fact no private investor is likely to participate in the recapitalization.”
SNS’s 301 million euros of 6.625 percent senior, unsecured bonds maturing in November 2016 were quoted 4 euro cents higher at 107.7, Bloomberg prices show. That’s after they fell to 102.71 Jan. 29.
The Dutch lender’s 615 million euros of 0.285 percent senior floating-rate notes due June 2014 were quoted up 1.8 euro cents at 95.62 cents, according to Bloomberg prices.
Bonds Seized
The decree published by the Dutch Ministry of Finance didn’t set out what would happen to junior bond trades executed in the three days running up to the expropriation. Bond trades typically settle three days after they’re agreed.
“I suspect the buyer of a bond yesterday won’t pay because he’s not delivered the securities,” said Bill Blain, a London- based strategist at brokerage Mint Partners Ltd.
Subordinated bonds issued by other banks fell. ING Groep NV’s 1.5 billion euros of 8 percent, junior subordinated perpetual notes redeemable by the lender this April dropped 1.5 cents to a four-month low of 100.04, Bloomberg prices show.
The 591.5 million euros of 4.875 percent junior subordinated notes due May 2016 of Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena SpA, the Italian lender whose credit rating was cut by Standard & Poor’s late yesterday, dropped 1 euro cent to 86.75. The securities were at 99.38 cents as recently as Jan. 22, Bloomberg prices show.
Risk Higher
The so-called impairment of SNS’s junior bondholders helped push the cost of insuring European lower-ranked bank debt to the highest since Dec. 11.
The Markit iTraxx Financial Index of credit-default swaps tied to the subordinated debt of 25 banks and insurers rose 12 basis points to 262, the biggest jump since October, according to prices compiled by Bloomberg. The senior gauge climbed three basis points to a 1 1/2-month high of 150.
Credit-default swaps pay the buyer face value in exchange for the underlying securities or the cash equivalent should a borrower fail to adhere to its debt agreements. A basis point on a contract protecting 10 million euros of debt for five years is equivalent to 1,000 euros a year.
SNS received a government bailout in 2008, two years after acquiring ABN Amro Holding NV’s property finance unit. The lender’s core Tier 1 capital ratio, a measure of financial strength, fell to 8.8 percent at the end of the third quarter, below the European Banking Authority’s 9 percent minimum, as real estate losses mounted.
To contact the reporter on this story: John Glover in London at [email protected]
To contact the editor responsible for this story: Paul Armstrong at [email protected]