Obbligazioni perpetue e subordinate Tutto quello che avreste sempre voluto sapere sulle obbligazioni perpetue... - Cap. 3 (4 lettori)

[Myskin]

Azz... ottimo prezzo... bravissimo!!!

Anch'io 97,625 con IWB

ciao,
mi uoi dire che tipo di subordinato è e quando è prevista la call?(maggio 2015)?
grazie

30 Giugno 2015... poi, in caso di mancato richiamo, Euribor 3 mesi + 3,10%...

t1 cumulativo 30 june 2015 call

t1 cum solo se viene violato il 5% del rapporto fatturato/cash-flow altrimenti NON è cum
pagano tassi molto bassi sui senior
SUEDZUCKER INTL 11/18 | Bond | A1GNRQ | XS0606202454 | Börse Frankfurt (Frankfurt Stock Exchange)

 

[solovaloreaggiunto]

onestamente per un post call a 3meur +3.10 per un BB+ con outlook negative ... passo

 

[NoWay]

guardate che Suedz ha detto che non richiamera' nel 2015 ,..ecco perche' sta venendo giu..
Alongside its final FY13/14 results, Südzucker (SZUGR) announced yesterday that its current preference is for not calling the SZUGR 5.25% perp (€700m) at the first call date (30 June 2015). The group had been guiding previously that three options were under consideration: 1) an open market tender, 2) a call in June 2015 (subject to the issuance of another hybrid within the 12 months preceding the first call date), or 3) take no action, i.e. not call with the coupon becoming variable after the first call date based on 3m Euribor+310bp. We have long held the view that replacing the existing perp by an instrument with similar terms would be significantly more expensive for SZUGR than leaving the current hybrid outstanding. .Hence, we are not surprised by SZUGR's decision. This is yet another reminder that investors should de-emphasise the importance of reputational risk when investing in corporate hybrids and instead focus on the economics of the call and extension risk.

Magari ora di giugno 2015 cambiano idea... dipenderà dal mercato, non pensi?

 

[Topgun1976]

guardate che Suedz ha detto che non richiamera' nel 2015 ,..ecco perche' sta venendo giu..
Alongside its final FY13/14 results, Südzucker (SZUGR) announced yesterday that its current preference is for not calling the SZUGR 5.25% perp (€700m) at the first call date (30 June 2015). The group had been guiding previously that three options were under consideration: 1) an open market tender, 2) a call in June 2015 (subject to the issuance of another hybrid within the 12 months preceding the first call date), or 3) take no action, i.e. not call with the coupon becoming variable after the first call date based on 3m Euribor+310bp. We have long held the view that replacing the existing perp by an instrument with similar terms would be significantly more expensive for SZUGR than leaving the current hybrid outstanding. .Hence, we are not surprised by SZUGR's decision. This is yet another reminder that investors should de-emphasise the importance of reputational risk when investing in corporate hybrids and instead focus on the economics of the call and extension risk.

Ok a 104 era troppo,ma a 98 o meno mi sembra buono..parliamo di una società con 20 anni di dvd

 

[solovaloreaggiunto]

okkio ad esporvi troppo... The perp started to sell off after the April profit warning (-4pt in April) but had recovered in the past few weeks and was still trading above par before yesterday's news. Repricing the bonds to perpetuity based on the current z-spread would imply a cash price of around 80. However, this instrument is callable at par every quarter if not called at the first call date. We believe the old Casino perp (€600m, 10y CMS+100bp), which has not been called but is also callable every quarter and is indicated at around 86, provides a better indication of the potential downside for hybrid holders. In practice, we think the SZUGR perp will trade higher than the old Casino perp because there is more than 12 months to the first call date (and the economics of the call could still change) and the group could opt for an open market tender should the discount to par become significant. All in all, we see fair value for the SZUGR perp in the low 90s and reiterate our Sell recommendation on this instrument

 

[NoWay]

t1 cum solo se viene violato il 5% del rapporto fatturato/cash-flow altrimenti NON è cum
pagano tassi molto bassi sui senior
SUEDZUCKER INTL 11/18 | Bond | A1GNRQ | XS0606202454 | Börse Frankfurt (Frankfurt Stock Exchange)

Precisazione molto importante... grazie!!!

 

[NoWay]

okkio ad esporvi troppo... The perp started to sell off after the April profit warning (-4pt in April) but had recovered in the past few weeks and was still trading above par before yesterday's news. Repricing the bonds to perpetuity based on the current z-spread would imply a cash price of around 80. However, this instrument is callable at par every quarter if not called at the first call date. We believe the old Casino perp (€600m, 10y CMS+100bp), which has not been called but is also callable every quarter and is indicated at around 86, provides a better indication of the potential downside for hybrid holders. In practice, we think the SZUGR perp will trade higher than the old Casino perp because there is more than 12 months to the first call date (and the economics of the call could still change) and the group could opt for an open market tender should the discount to par become significant. All in all, we see fair value for the SZUGR perp in the low 90s and reiterate our Sell recommendation on this instrument

Ma di chi sono questi commenti? Mi sembra difficile fare un paragone sia perchè i settori sono diversi sia perché la struttura dei bond è diversa...

 

[Topgun1976]

onestamente per un post call a 3meur +3.10 per un BB+ con outlook negative ... passo

e ti vuoi riempire di Rbs a 95,quando non si sà nemmeno se continerà a pagare cedole?Tu lo dai per scontato che continueranno a pagare?A me i conti non sembrano proprio buoni..

 

[solovaloreaggiunto]

cedola groupama minima 6.375% non male.....

 

[Topgun1976]

Ma di chi sono questi commenti? Mi sembra difficile fare un paragone sia perchè i settori sono diversi sia perché la struttura dei bond è diversa...

Sarà qlc casa d'affari,praticamente valutano il Bond sui 90,come Casino o Cnp,perchè andrà a 3,1%+ Euribor


Però per un altro annetto ci prendiamo il 5,25%,e poi si vedrà