Sig. Ernesto
Vivace Impertinenza
Second me è pure poco..pensa. Io sono però molto pessimista. Vediamo..tanto sono conti che prima o poi dovremmo avere.
Obbligazioni bancarie Obbligazioni Banca Popolare di Vicenza e Veneto Banca (2 lettori)
- Creatore Discussione darkog
- Data di Inizio
Jackrussel
Forumer storico
Greystone
Nuovo forumer
Una cosa è la valutazione patrimoniale di una società ad una certa data (ad es 17 marzo presentazione della richiesta di accesso RP o 30 giugno finalizzazione oprazione BadB e GoodB) che include le perdite alla data e quelle prevedibili (NPL perché applichiamo nuove direttive UE - 80% copertura) e un altra cosa sono le perdite future previste dal piano industriale......
Greystone
Nuovo forumer
un altra cosa......la valutazione dei crediti nel bilancio al 31 dicembre 2016 non viene fatta con riferimento al 31 dicembre 2016 ma deve tenere conto anche delle eventuali perdite fino alla data di approvazione del bilancio che è avvenuta ad aprile 2017......dunque se al 30 giugno è esplosa dovranno spiegare che è esplosa dalla data del CdA.......
Sig. Ernesto
Vivace Impertinenza
Italy tests EU’s bank bail-in regime to the limit
Italy is testing the limits of Europe’s bank bail-in regime. Regulators are threatening to block Rome’s plan to rescue two small lenders. A scheme to save Monte dei Paschi has also run into trouble. The government may yet have to help in any solution.
The European Commission allows governments to inject money into ailing lenders, but only if they are viable and private investors contribute. That’s proving a tricky hurdle for Italy to clear.
Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena’s rescue has already received the green light from Brussels, but it needs to find investors to shift 26 billion euros of bad debt off its books. Two of the mooted backers, Fortress Investment Group and Elliott Advisers, have just walked away, Reuters reported on June 16. A solution might still be found if Atlante, a bad loan investment vehicle funded by other Italian banks, takes more of the burden.
Rescuing two small Venetian banks – Banca Popolare di Vicenza and Veneto Banca – is proving even harder. The Commission wants at least 1.2 billion euros of the total 6.4 billion euro rescue package to come from the private sector. So far, other Italian banks have refused to help, making EU approval unlikely, La Stampa reported on June 18.
Another option is to follow Banco Santander’s recent takeover of Banco Popular in Spain. European regulators placed the country’s sixth-largest lender in resolution, wrote down its equity and subordinated debt, and sold the remainder for 1 euro.
A similar cleanup in Italy would see the Venetian banks sold to a bigger rival like Intesa Sanpaolo. Yet that still looks hard. Writing off combined equity and subordinated debt of 4.4 billion euros might just cover the cost of increasing provisions for bad and doubtful debts, Deutsche Bank reckons. But that would leave little margin for further losses – likely given the banks’ history of chequered lending – and potential litigation risks. Steeper losses would mean imposing haircuts on senior creditors, which could also harm depositors.
Another option is for the banks to be broken up, the good bits sold, and the bad debts left behind. The government would probably have to put up the capital for a bad bank. But regulators may see such a solution as preferable to bailing out a live institution. The outcome will depend on Europe’s willingness to be flexible with its rules.
Italy is testing the limits of Europe’s bank bail-in regime. Regulators are threatening to block Rome’s plan to rescue two small lenders. A scheme to save Monte dei Paschi has also run into trouble. The government may yet have to help in any solution.
The European Commission allows governments to inject money into ailing lenders, but only if they are viable and private investors contribute. That’s proving a tricky hurdle for Italy to clear.
Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena’s rescue has already received the green light from Brussels, but it needs to find investors to shift 26 billion euros of bad debt off its books. Two of the mooted backers, Fortress Investment Group and Elliott Advisers, have just walked away, Reuters reported on June 16. A solution might still be found if Atlante, a bad loan investment vehicle funded by other Italian banks, takes more of the burden.
Rescuing two small Venetian banks – Banca Popolare di Vicenza and Veneto Banca – is proving even harder. The Commission wants at least 1.2 billion euros of the total 6.4 billion euro rescue package to come from the private sector. So far, other Italian banks have refused to help, making EU approval unlikely, La Stampa reported on June 18.
Another option is to follow Banco Santander’s recent takeover of Banco Popular in Spain. European regulators placed the country’s sixth-largest lender in resolution, wrote down its equity and subordinated debt, and sold the remainder for 1 euro.
A similar cleanup in Italy would see the Venetian banks sold to a bigger rival like Intesa Sanpaolo. Yet that still looks hard. Writing off combined equity and subordinated debt of 4.4 billion euros might just cover the cost of increasing provisions for bad and doubtful debts, Deutsche Bank reckons. But that would leave little margin for further losses – likely given the banks’ history of chequered lending – and potential litigation risks. Steeper losses would mean imposing haircuts on senior creditors, which could also harm depositors.
Another option is for the banks to be broken up, the good bits sold, and the bad debts left behind. The government would probably have to put up the capital for a bad bank. But regulators may see such a solution as preferable to bailing out a live institution. The outcome will depend on Europe’s willingness to be flexible with its rules.
sassipaolo
Chesenso's way
MILANO (Reuters) - Cedono terreno stamane i bond senior di Popolare Vicenza e Veneto Banca dopo il rally della settimana scorsa, sulla rinnovata incertezza riguardo il percorso di salvataggio dei due istituti.
Come spiega un trader obbligazionario "la soluzione per arrivare alla ricapitalizzazione pubblica sembrava ormai alla portata, mentre ora spuntano ipotesi di bad bank, good bank, potenziale interesse di Intesa Sanpaolo: chiaramente la sensazione che se ne trae è che siamo ancora in alto mare".
ALTO MARE vuol dire, come scrivevo STAMANE, dover prendere in mano la TRIM al 30/06
Come spiega un trader obbligazionario "la soluzione per arrivare alla ricapitalizzazione pubblica sembrava ormai alla portata, mentre ora spuntano ipotesi di bad bank, good bank, potenziale interesse di Intesa Sanpaolo: chiaramente la sensazione che se ne trae è che siamo ancora in alto mare".
ALTO MARE vuol dire, come scrivevo STAMANE, dover prendere in mano la TRIM al 30/06
rockytamtam
Forumer storico
Visto che si procede per test , potrebbero a questo punto provare a farsi mettere in infrazione per il salvataggio ( tanto , una più una meno ). Così , per vedere quanto va a costare ... forse alla fine meno .
rockytamtam
Forumer storico
Era scritto tra il serio ed il faceto , sgorgata dal ribrezzo che provo per il governo del mio paese e la scellerata scelta di voler restare in un consesso col quale nulla abbiamo da spartire , solo farci distruggere . Chiaro che i due eunuchi non ci pensano nemmeno .
luperf
Nuovo forumer
Fitch Ratings-London-19 June 2017: The ECB's decision this month to put Spain's Banco Popular into resolution just a few days after the European Commission's agreement for precautionary recapitalisation of Italy's Banca Monte dei Paschi di Siena raises questions about the fate of two other troubled Italian banks, Fitch Ratings says.
Banca Popolare di Vicenza and Veneto Banca are in talks with the Italian and European authorities regarding precautionary recapitalisations, and Italy's finance minister said last week he expects a solution for the banks that does not include losses for senior creditors. The Italian authorities are particularly reluctant for senior debt to be bailed in, as many retail investors hold senior debt, and losses for them could hit financial stability. Senior bondholders would be vulnerable to losses if the banks were put into resolution, given their thin junior debt buffers. The Italian government passed a decree on 16 June that suspends reimbursement of subordinated bonds that mature within six months of a bank applying for a precautionary recapitalisation. This is to ensure buffers that should be available during burden-sharing do not decline because of debt maturities.
The resolution of Popular, the first under the EU's Bank Recovery and Resolution Directive, is a reminder that resolution is a possible outcome for Vicenza and Veneto, particularly if their precautionary recapitalisation falters. Their assessment for precautionary recapitalisation could be complicated by their plans to merge.
However, Vicenza and Veneto's circumstances differ from those of Popular. The ECB had determined that Popular was "failing or likely to fail" due to its recent stressed liquidity situation, whereas the Italian banks' liquidity is supported by their issuance of state-guaranteed notes. Popular had a strong and willing buyer, Banco Santander, with good capital market access, but there do not appear to be any likely buyers for the Italian banks. The stronger domestic banks in Italy all have to prioritise reduction of their own legacy impaired assets, and acquiring a troubled bank together with its impaired assets could damage the buyer and worsen the problem.
Many Italian banks contributed to rescue fund Atlante in 2016. The fund became the owner of Vicenza and Veneto after their capital increases. We warned then how the weaker Italian banks represent a contingent liability for the stronger and larger ones, and further calls on the stronger banks could put their creditworthiness at risk. Most have already taken significant impairments on their Atlante stakes in their 2016 financial statements.
The precautionary recapitalisation process in Italy has been long, adding to investor concerns about the banking sector and damaging the deposit franchises of the troubled banks being assessed. Vicenza and Veneto's market shares have declined, including in their home region of the Veneto, where they were historically strong. They are therefore becoming less systemically important, which may reduce the likelihood of precautionary recapitalisation.
Monte dei Paschi's precautionary recapitalisation follows its failed attempt to raise capital to cover its large volume of doubtful loans ("sofferenze"). But uncertainties remain. Receipt of public capital is conditional on the ECB confirming the bank is solvent and meeting Pillar 1 capital requirements, and on Italy obtaining formal confirmation from private investors that they will purchase the bank's portfolio of non-performing loans.
Our 'CCC'/Rating Watch Evolving IDR for Vicenza reflects our view that there is a real possibility that losses could be imposed on senior bondholders if the bank does not receive fresh capital in a precautionary recapitalisation, as conversion or write-down of junior debt alone would not strengthen capitalisation sufficiently.
We do not rate Veneto Banca.
<a href="Press Release">Fitch Affirms Santander at 'A-'; Downgrades Popular's VR to 'f'</a>
Contact:
Francesca Vasciminno
- Senior Director, Financial Institutions
- +39 02 87 90 87 225
- Fitch Italia S.p.a.
- Vicolo Santa Maria alla Porta, 1
- 20123, Milan
Christian Scarafia
- Senior Director, Financial Institutions
Banca Popolare di Vicenza and Veneto Banca are in talks with the Italian and European authorities regarding precautionary recapitalisations, and Italy's finance minister said last week he expects a solution for the banks that does not include losses for senior creditors. The Italian authorities are particularly reluctant for senior debt to be bailed in, as many retail investors hold senior debt, and losses for them could hit financial stability. Senior bondholders would be vulnerable to losses if the banks were put into resolution, given their thin junior debt buffers. The Italian government passed a decree on 16 June that suspends reimbursement of subordinated bonds that mature within six months of a bank applying for a precautionary recapitalisation. This is to ensure buffers that should be available during burden-sharing do not decline because of debt maturities.
The resolution of Popular, the first under the EU's Bank Recovery and Resolution Directive, is a reminder that resolution is a possible outcome for Vicenza and Veneto, particularly if their precautionary recapitalisation falters. Their assessment for precautionary recapitalisation could be complicated by their plans to merge.
However, Vicenza and Veneto's circumstances differ from those of Popular. The ECB had determined that Popular was "failing or likely to fail" due to its recent stressed liquidity situation, whereas the Italian banks' liquidity is supported by their issuance of state-guaranteed notes. Popular had a strong and willing buyer, Banco Santander, with good capital market access, but there do not appear to be any likely buyers for the Italian banks. The stronger domestic banks in Italy all have to prioritise reduction of their own legacy impaired assets, and acquiring a troubled bank together with its impaired assets could damage the buyer and worsen the problem.
Many Italian banks contributed to rescue fund Atlante in 2016. The fund became the owner of Vicenza and Veneto after their capital increases. We warned then how the weaker Italian banks represent a contingent liability for the stronger and larger ones, and further calls on the stronger banks could put their creditworthiness at risk. Most have already taken significant impairments on their Atlante stakes in their 2016 financial statements.
The precautionary recapitalisation process in Italy has been long, adding to investor concerns about the banking sector and damaging the deposit franchises of the troubled banks being assessed. Vicenza and Veneto's market shares have declined, including in their home region of the Veneto, where they were historically strong. They are therefore becoming less systemically important, which may reduce the likelihood of precautionary recapitalisation.
Monte dei Paschi's precautionary recapitalisation follows its failed attempt to raise capital to cover its large volume of doubtful loans ("sofferenze"). But uncertainties remain. Receipt of public capital is conditional on the ECB confirming the bank is solvent and meeting Pillar 1 capital requirements, and on Italy obtaining formal confirmation from private investors that they will purchase the bank's portfolio of non-performing loans.
Our 'CCC'/Rating Watch Evolving IDR for Vicenza reflects our view that there is a real possibility that losses could be imposed on senior bondholders if the bank does not receive fresh capital in a precautionary recapitalisation, as conversion or write-down of junior debt alone would not strengthen capitalisation sufficiently.
We do not rate Veneto Banca.
<a href="Press Release">Fitch Affirms Santander at 'A-'; Downgrades Popular's VR to 'f'</a>
Contact:
Francesca Vasciminno
- Senior Director, Financial Institutions
- +39 02 87 90 87 225
- Fitch Italia S.p.a.
- Vicolo Santa Maria alla Porta, 1
- 20123, Milan
Christian Scarafia
- Senior Director, Financial Institutions